Epi Experience & Early Symptoms

[NeylasMom]

I'm curious, for those of you who have had dogs diagnosed (confirmed dx through blood work) with EPI, what symptoms led you to the testing and diagnosis? Looking back, were there earlier more subtle symptoms that you now feel were early signs of the disease?

 

I'm asking because Violet has been having some unusual stomach issues, which could very well all be because her gut got super irritated from a weird meal, but some of it got me thinking about EPI so I did some reading and those things really seem to fit. I'm also reading that symptoms don't show up until the pancreas is already very compromised. So I don't want to jump the gun, the likelihood is that her gut just got messed up, but I also don't want to ignore something that might be really critical to catch early. I don't mind just paying for the enzyme test for peace if mind, but thought I'd ask here first since that does involve fasting and I may meet some resistance from my vet.

[greysmom]

This is sort of what I was thinking about with my comment in your other thread. It does sound very much like EPI, though I admit I have not had a dog with that disease and only have read about it here.

 

You might message member mychip as she just lost a dog with this - there's also a thread about her struggle with Reagan, though it doesn't talk about the very beginning of his diagnosis and treatment.

[Batmom]

From what I can recall of your other posts, doesn't sound like EPI or other pancreatic issue. But if you're concerned, there are some quick and easy tests (cTLI, for example).

[KF_in_Georgia]

If you can schedule an early-morning vet visit, fasting doesn't have to be a big deal. When I know we've scheduled lab work for one of mine, I fast both dogs from midnight on (water is fine, but no food). When we're ready to leave in the morning, I put the patient in the car, then run back in and pour a bowl of kibble for the dog staying home. Since my dogs regularly get a meal at bedtime, withholding breakfast isn't such an ordeal.

[NeylasMom]

If you can schedule an early-morning vet visit, fasting doesn't have to be a big deal. When I know we've scheduled lab work for one of mine, I fast both dogs from midnight on (water is fine, but no food). When we're ready to leave in the morning, I put the patient in the car, then run back in and pour a bowl of kibble for the dog staying home. Since my dogs regularly get a meal at bedtime, withholding breakfast isn't such an ordeal.

Yeah, mine are raw fed so they only eat in the evenings. So I would actually just need to feed her a bit earlier than normal the day before and it wouldn't be a big deal at all. That's a good point.

 

 

So the things that made me think about it - she had that terrible diarrhea. Did better once on Flagyl and even better once back on raw, but then got bad diarrhea again. Huge volumes if stool on the canned food with varying consistency, doing better once back on raw but I was finding undigested bone in her stool despite feeding only ground for the moment. That has improved somewhat though and could simply be because her pH was messed up from all of this so bone wasn't easy to digest at first. But I have also read that many EPI dogs do better on raw, but can have trouble digesting bone. Also read they appear to get better in ABs (like the Flagyl she was on) because they often also have SIBO then backslide. The other thing though that really got me thinking is that the one thing that clearly changed when she had the second round if diarrhea is that I had stopped the Vetriscience BD supplement I was giving, which has digestive enzymes. She is back on that on a double dose since the last round.

 

These aren't clear signs that she has EPI and everything can be explained away by other things (including that at times she has been really hungry and got a little guardy with Skye, which is rare, but she had meals where she got less food because if that canned bs), but just putting some of them together it made me wonder, especially when I read that much of the damage is done already when full on symptoms appear.

 

Of course, she may go back to normal and be fine, in which case this is all moot.

Edited November 25, 2017 by NeylasMom

[Batmom]

All the EPI dogs I've known personally -- once they started with the nasty stool and rapid weight loss, neither of those things changed until the EPI was treated. Which isn't to say she couldn't have it; just, her symptoms are different from what I've seen.

 

I have noticed that some dogs with a food sensitivity or tendency to pancreatitis will be fine on the triggering diet for several days, then ... whammo again. If I have suspicions about something like that, I prefer to leave on a "this works" diet/meds for at least 3 weeks before introducing anything else. 'Course you have to find a "this works" diet/meds first ....

 

Hope you can figure something else.

[NeylasMom]

All the EPI dogs I've known personally -- once they started with the nasty stool and rapid weight loss, neither of those things changed until the EPI was treated. Which isn't to say she couldn't have it; just, her symptoms are different from what I've seen.

 

I have noticed that some dogs with a food sensitivity or tendency to pancreatitis will be fine on the triggering diet for several days, then ... whammo again. If I have suspicions about something like that, I prefer to leave on a "this works" diet/meds for at least 3 weeks before introducing anything else. 'Course you have to find a "this works" diet/meds first ....

 

Hope you can figure something else.

Thanks. She seems to be doing okay at the moment. I think the ground has too much bone so I'm adding in some muscle meat. Going to keep up with that (and not give actual bones for a couple of weeks) like you said. I'm also avoiding chicken for the time being in case she's developed a sensitivity.

 

I also still haven't dewormed her and will probably do that sometime soon just in case.