Regurgitating And Peeing In Sleep...connected?

[Urismom]

Doris is 9.5 years old. She started regurgitating (not vomiting) portions of her food, water, or both, a few months ago...escalating to probably once or twice a day recently, with a reluctance to eat/decrease in appetite. So the vet did an exam and full bloodwork, urine test. Nothing wrong that he thought would lead to the regurgitating. He thought it might be reflux and put her on Reglan to help with gut motility, but after 2 weeks, I don't think it's helped at all.

 

Also over the course of the last month and a half, she has peed - I've concluded, in her sleep, during the daytime. Three times (that I know about) on a bed or a chair - not a full bladder's worth. Just knowing her habits, if she were awake and had to pee, she'd only do it standing up, never while just laying there in it, so I am 99% sure she's doing it in her sleep. And, it doesn't seem to matter if she's been walked recently. Today I walked her and she peed, went to the store for 2 hours, came home and found her laying in a puddle, unaware of it. This is after a clean bill of urinary health from last week's urine test.

 

So I've been focused on the regurgitating, but now the peeing-in-sleep issue is becoming more prominent. I was wondering if anyone had any experience with a single condition that leads to both symptoms? She's always been in very good health, so to have two things going wrong at once is new for us and I was wondering if they might be connected. (I'll be calling the vet Monday.)

 

 

 

 

 

[cleptogrey]

acid reflux??? pecid ac is pretty benign, 1 20mg tab 30 min before meal. it's a matter of what works, i've been on so many acid reflux drugs and most have not worked for me.with acid reflux many will become picky eaters, why eat if you don't feel good after? many dogs get it just once a day and it does the trick.

 

leaky bladder- lots of variables med wise out there. have you mentioned this to your vet? side effects w/ both DES and Proin, it's up to you and your vet if he/she feels she needs something. basically your dealing w/ a relaxed bladder, the hormone in DES tones it, Proin can cause a spike in blood pressure. felix was on both, Proin he was on the smallest dosage every other day, but we started w/ more and reduced. i saw some side effects, he went off it and seems to now be o.k. go know?

 

are they related? i don't think so, unless there is some strange syndrome out there. coincidence most likely. and urinary incontience can happen at any age.

[tbhounds]

Is her water consumption increased? Often when they have a belly ache they will drink more. I would try Pepcid or Prilosec to see if the regurge decreases. Honestly, if it continues you may consider having her scoped (I assume you already did rads and possible barium study?)

[NeylasMom]

I would get thee to a vet (specialist?) asap to rule out megaesophagus. While manageable, the regurgitation can cause a very serious condition called aspiration pneumonia so you want to get on managing the disease to prevent the regurgitation asap. Hopefully that's not what's going on, but given the frequency I fear its a possibility.

 

ME can apparently be secondary to other issues like Cushing's, which could cause the incontinence. Has she been drinking larger quantities of water/having a larger volume of urine? Is the urine dilute on the bedding (light in color, not a strong smell)?

 

http://healthypets.mercola.com/sites/healthypets/archive/2012/10/29/megaesophagus-disorder.aspx

Edited August 27, 2016 by NeylasMom

[Urismom]

I would get thee to a vet (specialist?) asap to rule out megaesophagus. While manageable, the regurgitation can cause a very serious condition called aspiration pneumonia so you want to get on managing the disease to prevent the regurgitation asap. Hopefully that's not what's going on, but given the frequency I fear its a possibility.

 

ME can apparently be secondary to other issues like Cushing's, which could cause the incontinence. Has she been drinking larger quantities of water/having a larger volume of urine? Is the urine dilute on the bedding (light in color, not a strong smell)?

 

http://healthypets.mercola.com/sites/healthypets/archive/2012/10/29/megaesophagus-disorder.aspx

 

The urine on the bed is dilute and not strong in color. Yes, she is drinking more water. He said one of her kidney values was slightly off but not enough to be causing problems yet. He did not think it was ME. Maybe this is a stupid question, but what sort of specialist would I see for ME?

 

I will be calling our vet Monday and mention the barium/scoping, and Cushings. I told him about the pee accidents last visit, but to be honest, they both happened at my parents house while they were dogsitting and I almost didn't believe them, she's never had an accident before so I thought for sure they were mistaken...till I found her in a puddle on our own bed.

[Guest MnMDogs]

ME can be diagnosed I think with an X-ray. I can't remember exactly, but I think that's how Mara's was diagnosed. We then transferred her care to an internal med specialist.

 

Good thoughts for your girl, I hope you get some answers.

Edited August 27, 2016 by MnMDogs

[NeylasMom]

I don't know a ton about ME so I could be way off base. Did your vet tell you why he didn't think it was ME?

 

If it were me, I would just go to an internal medicine specialist. I love my regular vet, but specialists are worth their weight in gold and since you have 2 separate issues going on it seems worth it to me. But specialists are easily accessible here, if not cheap. I realize that's not the case for everyone.

[tbhounds]

ME is super easy to see on an x-ray.

Guessing here but, I going to assume that her leaking may be caused by the excessive drinking. I would address her tummy woes first.

[cleptogrey]

how about ruling out easier to fix things first? work with your vet and come up with a logical plan and execute that first and see what happens. he may suggest simple things, smaller more frequent food, moistening it more so she's not drinking as much,changing or adding another PPI (pecid ac etc.). my friend has a male greyhound on 2 different PPIs. i agree fix one end and then see if the other still is malfunctioning. then move on and go for the big guns.

 

i was just sent to a specialist myself for my GERD. the dr. looked at me and wondered why i was sent in. my primary wanted me off one drug, it works for me, nothing else does. was she looking for the magic bullet? it doesn't exist. i'm on the same stuff and will return if it stops working. sometimes a specialist just isn't necessary, sometimes YES THEY ARE!!!

 

specialist here start at $150+ for initial consult, test$$$$, follow ups are usually around $110. in my book that's a lot of money.

[Batmom]

What I would do first is change her food and treats to something completely different -- different brand, no common ingredients if at all possible. Give it @ 2 weeks and see how she does. Then on to the vet if that doesn't help.

[cleptogrey]

Excellent Advice batmom!!

[Urismom]

Thank you all for the suggestions. I'm also going to ask if doing another urine sample from maybe earlier in the morning might show up a possible UTI better.

[Urismom]

Doris had an x-ray and (2!) barium swallows today, and there is no sign of megaesophagus. He is going to think on it over the weekend and then Monday probably refer us to a nearby internal medicine specialist. He was thinking perhaps an inflammatory upper GI issue.

 

He also suggested Proin for the incontinence, after reading threads on here, I am looking at Proin, DES, incurin, but very hesitant on all fronts. I have ordered some homeopathic "Leaks No More" to give that a try, but I imagine we'll end up on a prescription in the near future.

[tbhounds]

Please don't hesitate to use des-it's very safe with the low doses used to control spay incontinence.

[cleptogrey]

Please don't hesitate to use des-it's very safe with the low doses used to control spay incontinence.

we started with that. some people screamed, OMG- DES!!! but the dosage is low and it worked for over a year. then a small dose of Proin was used. my vet weans the dogs down to the lowest possible dose of pro in and then we administered it every other day. it worked, almost 2 years later i saw some side effects,(weight loss etc) took him off and he's been fine. go know?

 

i used to believe in homeopathic remedies...but they don't always work.i found out the hard way with myself and my battle w/ GERD. sometimes modern meds just do the trick.

 

and they didn't prescribe anything for the digestive issues? huh?

Edited September 2, 2016 by cleptogrey

[Urismom]

So on the regurgitating, Doris was scheduled for an ultrasound with an internal medicine specialist this afternoon. Then this morning, she vomited (actual heaving vomit with bile, not regurgitating) and out came this white plastic ring, like from a water bottle. So, this could of course be something she randomly ingested this morning.....or, we are wondering if this has been lodged in her since the winter. I've read that blockages can cause regurgitating, loss of appetite, gulping, etc., and that's all her. And, since it's plastic it would not necessarily have shown up on her xrays last week. I had been praying that today's ultrasound would be conclusive, rather than just part of an expensive wild good chase, and I am wondering if this is an answer to that prayer. At any rate, I canceled the ultrasound and will give it a few days to see if she has any change. If not, I can reschedule the ultrasound next week. They schedule within a day or so.

 

[NeylasMom]

It is possible. I've seen items stay in dogs stomachs for months to be vomited later. However, did you clean that off before photographing? If it had been in her stomach a long time, I would expect it to be clumped with fur and possibly other things because of the sharp pointy bits. However, if you cleaned it off then that could be your culprit. Hope that's what it was!

[Urismom]

It is possible. I've seen items stay in dogs stomachs for months to be vomited later. However, did you clean that off before photographing? If it had been in her stomach a long time, I would expect it to be clumped with fur and possibly other things because of the sharp pointy bits. However, if you cleaned it off then that could be your culprit. Hope that's what it was!

 

You're probably right and it's a long shot. It came out pretty clean. To my thinking, it would have been an esophagus blockage, not a stomach thing, because her problem was regurgitating food before it even made it to the stomach....but still, even in the esophagus, it would have gotten grub and hair on it. Theoretically, no harm done if I give it a few days and then just reschedcule the ultrasound.

 

I am, at any rate, relieved that this ring came out, no matter when it went in!

[NeylasMom]

 

You're probably right and it's a long shot. It came out pretty clean. To my thinking, it would have been an esophagus blockage, not a stomach thing, because her problem was regurgitating food before it even made it to the stomach....but still, even in the esophagus, it would have gotten grub and hair on it. Theoretically, no harm done if I give it a few days and then just reschedcule the ultrasound.

 

I am, at any rate, relieved that this ring came out, no matter when it went in!

That does make sense. Let's hope! Please keep us updated.

 

And I certainly agree - waiting a few days to see if her symptoms resolve before an expensive and potentially stressful test makes total sense to me.

[Urismom]

Doris had an ultrasound today...it was inconclusive, didn't show anything particularly useful, and the next step is endoscopy/biopsy under anesthesia. I feel very deflated. I was really hoping the ultrasound would show something helpful and we could avoid all that. I feel like we are on a wild goose chase, expensive, and now the risk of anesthesia at age 9.

 

The only thing he got from it was that the view was partially obstructed by food from yesterday still in her stomach which -- after the preparatory fasting -- should have been completely emptied out. So, things are not moving through as they should, which fits with the regurgitating.

 

Sigh. Meanwhile, Doris loved the ultrasound appointment. New place with new people? Attention? Laying down? Getting attention while laying down? Doris' dream morning. My little sweetie.

[NeylasMom]

So I take it the symptoms didn't resolve after the soda bottle thing came up? Sorry you didn't get definitive answers. Wounds like the additional tests might be worthwhile.

[Urismom]

Yeah, no, she regurgitated that night and then again yesterday, and today, so we went ahead with the ultrasound. It was wishful thinking, the plastic ring was so clean, there is no way it was in her for very long.

[Urismom]

Doris is about to go under anesthesia and have her endoscopy. One nervous mama over here....

[Ragsysmum]

Thinking of you both.

[Urismom]

Doris is awake and standing, I can pick her up in 2 hours. They took 7 teeth while she was under, glad of that. But...they found a bloody, bad-looking growth in her stomach, 3-5 days till the biopsy results. He said her "stomach was not normal" and her upper intestine was "not normal." He thinks that is inflammatory bowel disease.

 

He said she's a "great dog" (this was a specialist we just met today).

 

I had been hoping they would find something definitive, instead of just saying it was old-age lack of motility (which he said was possible)....I take that back, I wish they hadn't found something like this.