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Need Help On What To Do Next :( Limping


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Guest rennina

Sorry I didn't find the O-thread, so can anyone tell me how to get remote help from OSU/Dr Couto?

 

My 3 year old AKC girl Misty has been limping on her left hind leg for a few weeks. I had her X-rays done. Dr. suspected bone cyst or tumor so he forwarded it to a radiologist and a surgeon. They both suspect some kind of bone tumors so our Dr. wants to do biopsy asap. I mentioned FNA to him, but he said it may not give us a clear diagnosis.

 

So what should I do next? I definitely want to get a second opinion because I don't believe she can get cancer (details to follow). I wonder if anyone can send me a link or contact info, so I can let my vet forward the X-rays?

 

Thank you guys!

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Guest rennina

OK here are the details:

 

Misty is 3 years old AKC greyhound. Her breeder told me she doesn't have any bone cancer case in her pedigree.

 

She had an incident in a dog park when she was around 6 months old. She was running hard with other dogs but suddenly let out a big cry and held her left rear leg up. We thought she might hurt her leg on the picnic table or something but not sure what happened. She was limping for a few hours, but by the time we got her to the vet she was fine. Dr said it might be a muscle strain. That was her first incident.

 

Over the two to three years she had a few (3, maybe) incidents with that leg. One time she was playing with another dog, she screamed suddenly looking like she was having cramps. I'm not sure if it was the same leg. She was fine after I grabbed and walked her for 30 seconds. She was happy and wanted to go back playing. The other two incidents were when she jumped to a play bow to me and to another dog she cried. These times I was sure it was the same leg.

 

About a month ago when the weather was finally cooled down I took her for a lot of off leash hiking and running. I noticed that occasionally she would lift that paw for a second after hard running. I checked her leg and let our vet checked her but none of us found any pain point. So I let her rest for a few days. But last Saturday I let her off leash again and noticed she was bunny hopping. Since then it got worse and she became limping while walking.

 

She's been happy and wanting to play outside, eating as normal, BM normal. It seems nothing bothers her except for the limping. The only time she felt horrible is after the sedation for her X-rays. It took her a few hours to fully recover.

 

She's on Benadryl now.


Here ya go! Please keep us posted.
http://www.coutovetconsultants.com

 

Thank you! I found that link but was confused. Should I ask my vet to forward the X-rays to his email (coutovetconsultants@gmail.com), or use the Vetoclock link?

 

I'm also confused about the OSU consulting. Is it a different service from Dr. Couto's?

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Dr. Couto used to be at at OSU. He has since left and has his own consultancy.


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Guest rennina

Dr. Couto used to be at at OSU. He has since left and has his own consultancy.

Oh I see. Thank you so much! I just sent his website and email to our vet.

 

I have the X-rays but will need a Windows computer to open it. I'll try to borrow one later tonight or tomorrow so I can post her X-rays here.

 

I feel upset...trying to be positive now...I still don't believe she will get any sort of tumors at this age. So I don't want to do the biopsy right now if I can avoid it.

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Guest rennina

Thank you for all your kind replies. I will update when I get back from our vet.

 

I asked if it could be fungal infection but Dr said no. I'll ask him about Valley Fever tomorrow but I feel it may not be the case. Misty did have a Lyme test done a few weeks ago and it was negative. Not sure if they did the full panel. We live in MN.

 

I just hope they can rule out OS without doing a biopsy. Misty seems quite sensitive, so I'm trying to avoid anesthesia and surgery. She was so miserable after her spay surgery. Last night she was very uncomfortable from the sedation for her X-rays :( I'm also concerned about damages to the bone.

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Im no expert but has an MRI been done to look at her ligaments and tendons?

 

My boy has a strained toe atm, and they said if it doesnt heel by X date then an MRI could be done to see why. (xray was done, same issue with sedation for us, HOURS he whined and paced).

 

Our vet said a 3yo with OS even non AKC would be very very rare.

 

I'd really push to have any test YOU WANT done to rules things out. Get them to test for Valley Fever that way you know its been done and can be fully crossed from the list.

 

I do hope it's something like a strained liagment.

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Hmmm... here's my two cents, I've had two greyhounds. One is a 4-year-old, healthy AKC boy. My other boy was a retired racer, and DID have a fibrosarcoma tumor, which is a type of bone cancer. So I've had some experience from both sides.

 

When something mysterious comes up on x-ray and it's a greyhound, nine times out of ten, your vet is going to default to a cancer diagnosis. But given that your girl comes from an AKC line and she's only 3-years-old, I'd be inclined to believe yours is that one out of ten that isn't. Unfortunately, the only way you'll be able to know for sure is to test that mass. I would definitely encourage you to follow Dr. Couto's recommendation. In the meantime, I'd take her to be seen at a specialty vet or a clinic that is equipped with an oncology division. Ask for a FNA (fine needle aspirate). That type of test will extract cells from this mass, and tell you for starters, if it's cancer, and two, if it's malignant. An actual biopsy of the bone is painful and requires heavy sedation. FNAs aren't bad. If your dog will tolerate it, they can be done with light sedative and local anasthetic. Then hopefully, you'll have some answers on what you need to do moving forward.

 

Anything can happen, but it's exceedingly unlikely that a three-year-old AKC greyhound would have OSA. I'd try not to worry too much. Yet.

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Guest rennina

Im no expert but has an MRI been done to look at her ligaments and tendons?

 

My boy has a strained toe atm, and they said if it doesnt heel by X date then an MRI could be done to see why. (xray was done, same issue with sedation for us, HOURS he whined and paced).

 

Our vet said a 3yo with OS even non AKC would be very very rare.

 

I'd really push to have any test YOU WANT done to rules things out. Get them to test for Valley Fever that way you know its been done and can be fully crossed from the list.

 

I do hope it's something like a strained liagment.

 

Got it. I'll let them check on that. Thanks :)

 

It seems our vet has ruled out ligament/soft tissue injuries, and thinks it's either cyst or cancer. That's why he wants me to do biopsy. The X-rays show a darker area on the bone as long as a small amount of fluid near the knee.

 

Right now I just don't know if I should convince him to do FNA now, or if I should wait until I get back from Dr. Couto?

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FNA isn't too bad for them. If she'll stand still they could do it without sedation as they are pretty quick.

We get told to take ours for a long walk before the vet visit so the wriggles are gone..LOL (He's 3yo too and acts like a puppy in some ways..LOL)

 

I'd personally excuse the easy less invasive options first, that way Dr Couto can get fast results to give a better diagnosis.

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Guest rennina

Came back from the vet with Misty.

 

We followed Dr. Couto's advice to rule out blastomycosis first. Our vet examined the lymph node and did blood work. All is normal, so he thinks it's not fungal infection. So I let him do a FNA of the bone area. The result will come back in a few days. So waiting waiting waiting....

 

 

Poor Misty got a staple for the FNA. The opening was quite large (about 1.5 cm, still bleeding when she came out). And I noticed there's a lot of blood stain on her leg. Is FNA supposed to be like this? I thought it's just a "needle"...

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Guest rennina

Here's my guess---I bet the bone was too,strong and they needed to use a Jamshidi biopsy needle..

 

It's her proximal tibial, so that makes sense to me. Thank you for reply. Feeling relieved to know it can be normal :)

 

Fingers crossed the result will turn out to be something easy to fix.

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Guest rennina

Results were back. No cancer, no infection. Still don't know what's going on. Our vet wants to do biopsy or FNA again because last sample contained too much blood and was not good enough. I refused. I pushed him to do a Valley Fever titer, although he didn't think it's possible since Misty only lived in CO and MN. We also did a chest X ray but everything looks normal.

 

:(

 

 

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Keep fighting for your pup!

 

This might be a little silly, but have you checked for corns? Corns this young are uncommon but corns are very common among greyhounds. Are all the feets and toes ok? Secondly, if all x-rays seem to be clear, have you considered a chiropractor? Just trying to shed a different light on the limp.....wondering if maybe there is compensation on one leg and the focus is in the wrong place?

Edited by XTRAWLD

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Guest rennina

Why would he be against ruling everything out? Valley fever has been reported in those states, very rare but not impossible.

 

Dr. Couto also thinks it's highly unlikely she will have VF. I had it tested anyway, but am very sure it will come back negative :(

 

I'm feeling helpless now. It seems biopsy is the only option right now if I want to figure out why she's limping.

Keep fighting for your pup!

 

This might be a little silly, but have you checked for corns? Corns this young are uncommon but corns are very common among greyhounds. Are all the feets and toes ok? Secondly, if all x-rays seem to be clear, have you considered a chiropractor? Just trying to shed a different light on the limp.....wondering if maybe there is compensation on one leg and the focus is in the wrong place?

 

Her X-rays showed left proximal tibial lesion :(

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:(

 

FWIW, I gave the university vets permission to do a biopsy if the FNA wasn't good enough (they have a cytologist review the slide before waking the dog up, just in case). They didn't have to do a biopsy in our case. But, they said they had never had a problem with the bone breaking after they had done one. Small comfort, but.

 

Hugs.

Star aka Starz Ovation (Ronco x Oneco Maggie*, litter #48538), Coco aka Low Key (Kiowa Mon Manny x Party Hardy, litter # 59881), and mom in Illinois
We miss Reko Batman (Trouper Zeke x Marque Louisiana), 11/15/95-6/29/06, Rocco the thistledown whippet, 04/29/93-10/14/08, Reko Zema (Mo Kick x Reko Princess), 8/16/98-4/18/10, the most beautiful girl in the whole USA, my good egg Joseph aka Won by a Nose (Oneco Cufflink x Buy Back), 09/22/2003-03/01/2013, and our gentle sweet Gidget (Digitizer, Dodgem by Design x Sobe Mulberry), 1/29/2006-11/22/2014, gone much too soon. Never forgetting CJC's Buckshot, 1/2/07-10/25/10.

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Why not run a ct scan??

 

This is probably how I'd move forward if she were my dog. They got the FNA, which didn't show anything. No sense in putting her through a biopsy if it could weaken the bone and hurt her more in the longterm. If TBDs and malignant cancers can be ruled out, you may be looking at a benign tumor. Osteochondroma wouldn't be unheard of in this case, considering her age and history. I could see an AKC dog being genetically more likely to develop something like that during bone development. I think osteochondromas are more likely to affect the long bones too (although I'm not 100% on that). ETA: I looked back at some of your original posts... first incident at 6 months old, then more incidents of limping in the first year. Definitely could be osteochondroma. I'm sending some more info along from UPenn's website:

 

Osteochondroma is a cartilage-capped bony projection that may arise in any bone that develops from Cartilages The tumor may be either solitary, a monostotic osteochondroma, or multiple, polyostotic osteochondromas, also referred to as osteochondromatosis or multiple cartilaginous exostosis. Polyostotic osteochondromas are a heritable entity in dogs. Osteochondromas are found in young immature dogs during the period of active bone growth. They respond to the same trophic influence as the growth plate and cease growth at skeletal maturity.(14) No sex predilection has been noted. Great Danes, Saint Bernards, and Hounds may be affected more commonly than other breeds. The osteochondromas arise from the metaphyseal portions of long bones in the dog, particularly the femur and tibia (Fig. 75-7).(1,4,5,11,13) Vertebral involvement of cervical and thoracic vertebrae has also been found..(5,15) Tracheal involvement has been noted.

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