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Couldn't Do A Dental


shel0306
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My 11 yr old Grey went in for her dental today and they called after the bloodwork to say they didn't think a dental was a good idea as her creatine was at 2.3. Her last creatine check was in 2011 and it was 2. She said the increase was enough that she felt another test was necessary before doing the dental. I was fine with that, I didn't want to risk kidney failure. My Vet said she could have kidney disease, we are awaiting test results(SDMA is what it is listed as on my bill but I can't remember the name of the test) which take 48 hrs to get back. She did test her urine and it was fine. This is all new to me but if I understood her correctly, this test we sent away will tell us if perhaps 2.3 is her "Normal" and then a dental would be ok to proceed with or if she is indeed now facing kidney disease. Her teeth have always been bad so a dental is needed yearly but I have been going every 2 yrs. Until the test results she is on Clavamox as the Vet did see a molar she thinks needs attention and may be hurting her a bit. So my question is: If indeed it is kidney disease what kind of food have you tried that your Grey will eat? My Kasey isn't a great eater so switching food will be hard for her and if it doesn't taste good I'm afraid she won't eat. My Vet already mentioned once we know using a special Science Diet. Never been a fan of Science Diet so looking for other alternatives. If the test comes back that 2.3 is nothing to worry about do I dare do the dental? I'm nervous now :( Anyone with experience and advice I would appreciate it, I have a whole list of her panel results but the creatine seemed to be the only red flag. I want to do what's best for my girl, she MUST live forever :beatheart

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Relax. Or try to; I know it's hard. Kidney disease wouldn't keep you from doing a dental. You'd just take some extra precautions with choices of meds, use of fluids, etc.

 

What is the normal range for creatinine on your panel? And, what's the normal range and your dog's value for BUN?

 

We have had a couple kidney-disease dogs over the years. One happily ate K/D canned for years. Another, I felt it was more economical (and more suitable for that dog) to home-cook. If a prescription food turns out to be advisable, note that Purina, Royal Canin, and one or two others have prescription foods, and some dogs prefer one brand over the other.

Star aka Starz Ovation (Ronco x Oneco Maggie*, litter #48538), Coco aka Low Key (Kiowa Mon Manny x Party Hardy, litter # 59881), and mom in Illinois
We miss Reko Batman (Trouper Zeke x Marque Louisiana), 11/15/95-6/29/06, Rocco the thistledown whippet, 04/29/93-10/14/08, Reko Zema (Mo Kick x Reko Princess), 8/16/98-4/18/10, the most beautiful girl in the whole USA, my good egg Joseph aka Won by a Nose (Oneco Cufflink x Buy Back), 09/22/2003-03/01/2013, and our gentle sweet Gidget (Digitizer, Dodgem by Design x Sobe Mulberry), 1/29/2006-11/22/2014, gone much too soon. Never forgetting CJC's Buckshot, 1/2/07-10/25/10.

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What a worry for you, but what a good and attentive vet you have there. It may be that you can only risk dental work if the dog has very severe gum disease or an abscess which risks letting deadly bacteria into the blood which might cause septicemia and organ failure.

 

Greys typically have more elevated kidney numbers than other dogs and, especially so if they have recently exercized. A urine dip test from a fresh morning catch usually tells the true story.

 

Kidney disease on dogs is hugely complex and depends on many factors. One of mine that had CRF lived 2 happy years after dx, another died at 5 from acute kidney failure.

 

For more information please visit the dogaware site

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creatine reference was listed as 0.5-1.8 and hers was 2.3 and was 2.0 at her last dental. BUN was 17 and reference is listed as 7-27. Urine was 1.036 These numbers are a bit confusing to me, I have a whole page of numbers on her blood and urine, the Vet only went over a few of them, the ones that were concerning to her.

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creatine reference was listed as 0.5-1.8 and hers was 2.3 and was 2.0 at her last dental. BUN was 17 and reference is listed as 7-27. Urine was 1.036 These numbers are a bit confusing to me, I have a whole page of numbers on her blood and urine, the Vet only went over a few of them, the ones that were concerning to her.

Those a greyt numbers. The creatinine can fluctuate depending on certain factors--feeding raw for example can elevate the level-have you changed foods? The fact that the BUN is well within the norm is wonderful and the urine specific gravity (which measures the concentration of the urine--how well the kidneys concentrate) is good too. Ideally you would like to see the number at or above 1.030 and my guess is the sample you submitted wasn't the first urine of the day--the first urine should be the highest.

So, your vet is wise to monitor the levels but, IMO I would have still performed the dentistry. If your vet wanted to be cautious she/he would just need to take precautions like check blood pressures (which should be done anyway) before and during the procedure and rethink the IV fluid rate.

The smda test is rather new and I think the jury is out regarding it's value. Breathe--she's ok.

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Thanks for the info, I feel better. I was afraid to do anything once I heard Kidney disease but now I feel better informed. Well, the dental would have been $600 and today alone for tests and antibiotics was $300 so when all is said and done I'll be in a grand:( Good thing my Kasey is so special :D

Oh and you are correct they took the urine sample at the office and I know for a fact she peed here twice before her appt.

Edited by shel0306
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Submit the first am urine to your vet so they could run a USG (urine specific gravity test)--takes 2 drops of urine and the tech could do the test in about 1 minute.

Edited to add-might not change too much because she was fasted for the procedure but, it can't hurt to recheck.

Edited by tbhounds
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Thanks for the info, I feel better. I was afraid to do anything once I heard Kidney disease but now I feel better informed. Well, the dental would have been $600 and today alone for tests and antibiotics was $300 so when all is said and done I'll be in a grand:( Good thing my Kasey is so special :D

Oh and you are correct they took the urine sample at the office and I know for a fact she peed here twice before her appt.

Oh my ... where are you located? There's a fabulous grey-savvy vet in Tinley Park (I355 & I80 ... south side of Chicago) that would charge less than half that for the dental ... possibly worth the drive.

 

PM me for Dr. Wahl's info if you'd like it.

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Well, the SDMA test came back today. 0-14 is Normal and Kasey was a 16. Vet said for a Greyhound up to 15 can be considered normal so she is in the very early stages of kidney disease. She said she probably has about 20 percent of lost function already but that isn't enough to affect her day to day life. We are going to do the dental Tuesday, hopefully she does wonderful. With 2 infected teeth I feel it is worth the risk and the Vet agreed that with a little extra vigilance on her blood pressure and fluids she should do fine. She's had several dentals with this Vet through the years and done fine, I'll just be a little extra nervous. One thing I didn't ask is if indeed it's Kidney Disease(I still want to hope that her creatine and SDMA scores are just her "Normal") will this get worse quickly or could it be a year or two before she starts having failure, anyone know?


Oh my ... where are you located? There's a fabulous grey-savvy vet in Tinley Park (I355 & I80 ... south side of Chicago) that would charge less than half that for the dental ... possibly worth the drive.

 

PM me for Dr. Wahl's info if you'd like it.

I'm in Moline, IL so Chicago is a 2 1/2 hrs away. I can think of a million shopping reasons to make the trip extra justified though :D

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