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How Long Before It's "safe" To Let Them Off Their Lead?


Guest Marie_Imbrium

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Guest Scouts_mom

I'm in the "It depends on the dog" category. My Henry never lets me out of his sight or hearing and I trust him off leash in quiet areas. Bree has very selective hearing plus a stubborn streak and I would never trust her.

 

GreyOrchard's book, "Understanding Greyhounds, Our Companions Through the Ages," is fascinating and clearly links our modern grey's behavior with their 2+ thousand year history of working with people. The section on recall is great. My only concern about the book is it is written about UK greyhounds and some things are different in the USA, so if you are in the States you need to be alert to the differences.

 

I do let both my greys run off leash at a beach near my folks' home on Puget Sound. The beach is enclosed by cliffs, a headland and a deep stream so they can't go far. Plus, I can see the entire beach to make sure there are no small dogs or toddlers around. The dogs love it, but never seem to learn that salt water is not good to drink.

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Never. Below is from a GPA news item.

Trust: The Deadly Disease

Many of us have read this article as well as heard stories about what can happen when your dog goes off lead. Human nature is to think "this wont ever happen to us" so I am posting the article "Trust, A Deadly Disease" to remind us, both old and new adopters, that even the simplest thing like going to the mailbox or the car can end up tragic.

There is a deadly disease stalking your dog. A hideous stealthy thing just waiting for its chance to steal your beloved friend. It is not a new disease, or one for which there are inoculations. The disease is called TRUST...

You knew before you ever took your Greyhound home that it could not be trusted. The people who provided you with this precious animal warned you, drummed into your head that a newly rescued racer may steal off counters, destroy something expensive, chase cats and must NEVER be allowed off his lead!!

When the big day finally arrived, heeding the sage advice, you escorted your Greyhound to his new home, properly collared and tagged, the lead held high in your hand. At home the house was "doggie proofed". Everything of value was stored in the spare bedroom, garbage stowed on top of the refrigerator, cats separated and a gate placed across the door to the living room. All windows and doors had been properly secured and signs placed in strategic points reminding all to "CLOSE THE DOOR."

Soon it becomes second nature to make sure the door closes a second after it is opened and that it is securely latched. "DON'T LET THE DOG OUT" is your second most verbalized expression. (The First is NO!) You worry and fuss constantly, terrified that your darling will get out and disaster will surely follow. Your friends comment about who you love most, your family or the dog. You know that to relax your vigil for even a moment could loose him to you forever.

And so the weeks and months pass, with your Greyhound becoming more civilized every day, the seeds of TRUST are planted. It seems that each new day brings less mischief, less breakage. Almost before you know it your racer has turned into an elegant, dignified friend.

Now that he is a more reliable, sedate companion, you can take him more places. No longer does he chew the steering wheel when left alone in the car. And darned if the cake wasn't still on the counter this morning. And. Oh yes, wasn't that the cat he was sleeping with so cozily on your pillow last night? At this point you are beginning to become infected, the disease is spreading its roots deep into your mind.

And then one of your friends suggests obedience training. You shake your head and remind her that your dog might run away if allowed off lead, but you are reassured when she promises that the events are held in a fenced area. And wonder of wonders he did not run away, but came every time you called him!

All Winter long you go to weekly obedience classes. After a time you even let him run loose from the car to the house when you get home. Why not, he always runs straight to the door, dancing a frenzy of joy and waits to be let in. Remember, he comes every time he is called. You know he is the exception that proves the rule. (And sometimes late at night, you even let him slip out the front door to go potty and then right back in.) At this point the disease has taken hold, waiting only for the right time and place to rear its ugly head.

Years pass-it's hard to remember why you ever worried so much when he was new. He would never think of running out the door, left open while you bring in the packages from the car. It would be beneath his dignity to jump out of the car window while you run into the convenience store. And when you take him for those wonderful long walks at dawn, it takes only one whistle to send him racing back to you in a burst of speed when the walk comes too close to the highway. (He still gets into the garbage but nobody is perfect.)

This is the time that the disease has waited for so patiently. Some times it only has to wait a year or two, but often it takes much much longer.

He spies the neighbors dog across the street, and suddenly forgets everything he ever knew about not slipping outdoors, jumping out windows, or coming when called due to traffic. Perhaps it was only a paper fluttering in the breeze, or even just the sheer joy of running.

Stopped in an instant. Stilled forever-your heart is broken at the sight of his still, beautiful body. The disease is TRUST. The final outcome, HIT BY A CAR.

Every morning my dog, Shah, bounced around off his lead exploring. Every morning for seven years he came back every time he was called. He was perfectly obedient, perfectly trustworthy. He died fourteen hours after being struck by the car. PLEASE do not risk your friend or your heart. Save the trust for things that do not matter.

I would like to offer two additional accounts regarding dangers of unfenced areas.

The first account is really a basic tragic accident due to an improperly fitting collar that COULD have been avoided. The owners actually had their dog on lead but unfortunately they were using a traditional flat buckle collar on their Greyhound. The dog became frightened and simply backed right out of her collar. She took off at top speed. Before the owners could even get close to her she had run headlong into traffic and was killed instantly by a car. This is one of the reasons that we insist on using the MARTINGALE or HUMANE CHOKE Greyhound collar.

The second account involves too much trust and a lack of common sense. The owners lived in the country. Their home was surrounded by woods and they were well off any major highway. They had their dog only about 3 weeks when the call we hate to hear the most came. "Our Greyhound Is Lost" The owners do not have a fenced yard but had sworn to keep their Greyhound on lead anytime it was out of doors. Upon further questioning, we learned they had quit using the leash after the first week because the weather was cold, and it was early morning when the dog had to go out. They had simply been letting her out the back door, waiting for her to do her business and then calling her back inside. "She ALWAYS came when she was called," the woman lamented. They thought it was safe to let her out without a leash because they lived so far from a high traffic road. After all she was only off lead for such short bits of time!

Unfortunately the little Greyhound bounded off into the woods on this particular morning. Perhaps she heard a squirrel rustling about in some nearby leaves, or smelled a rabbit, but whatever the reason she had run off and they could not find her. Our hopes of finding her safe and sound faded a little more with each passing day, with no sign of the pretty little female greyhound.

After several weeks our worst fears were confirmed, There was a call from a very nice man who had been walking through the woods with his son when they discovered the still, cold body of the small, dead Greyhound. He got our number from the collar ID tag. She was found many many miles from her home.

Why did she run off this time when she had been so reliable before? Why did she not come racing back when her family called out to her? Who knows? What we DO know is that ultimately, DOGS WILL BE DOGS. No matter how much or how long you train them there may come a point when their instincts will overcome any learned behavior., PLEASE do NOT be fooled into a false sense of security with your Greyhound. Take the time, make that little extra effort, to ensure your Greyhound will always be safe. Remember - they are depending on YOU.

Edited by racindog
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I am part of the "never" off leash club. No dog is 100% predictable all the time. All the training in the world can't erase thousands of years of instict to run and hunt. Not worth the risk.

I know some people on Greytalk do let their hounds off leash. I just pray that you never have to post a heartbreaking post that your dog met an untimely death that could have been prevented.

Your hound is beautiful by the way. Welcome to Greytalk! We have lots of opinions here because we love our hounds so much.

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Not worth the risk.I know some people on Greytalk do let their hounds off leash. I just pray that you never have to post a heartbreaking post that your dog met an untimely death that could have been prevented.

Wow. Rude and unnecessary much? I could say the EXACT same thing about not putting time and effort into recall training even when "my dog never goes off leash". Someone JUST posted about their dog doing zoomies in traffic because he slipped out a door. You can guilt trip me all you want about the fact that I off leash my dogs in reasonably safe places, but when my dogs slip out an open door or I drop a leash they come back when they are called. I've already said that not off leashing is a responsible choice if you're not going to make the effort to proof your recall. There are a lot of dogs out there that have no business being off leash, regardless of breed. But I don't GUILT TRIP anyone on here that they are going to be responsible for their dog's death as a result of a "poor decision" to not train something reasonably simple. Quite frankly, though, even with the additional calculated risks of being off leash I still think a dog with a 90% recall is safer than a dog that has poor recall and is never off leash... until it is by accident.

 

I would love to know where this "never let your greyhound off leash" bulldoodie came from in North America. If this was actual truth and reality... don't you think it would be true in Europe as well? Don't you think it would be true of breeder bred dogs? Don't you think my breeder would be horrified by my off leashing the dog she gave me? But no, it is just the North American adoption scene that has this fanatical obsession. Yes, you have to train. Yes, there are some instincts that are hard to train out. Yes, some individuals can never be off leash. Yes, you have to be smart about where you let any dog off leash, and perhaps a little extra so with a greyhound. But this BLANKET STATEMENT is detrimental to every greyhound out there because it leads to this rampant idea that these dogs can't be trained, and so the majority of people rely on leashes and closed doors instead; when a door fails a dog with no training the chance you take is much greater than the ones I take.

 

Everyone is going to make a choice they feel comfortable with. And that's fine. No one else has to be comfortable with it. But don't guilt trip someone just because they've made a decision you wouldn't, especially when it is done carefully and with planning. Just because your decision goes with the majority, doesn't automatically make it right. Have a little respect for other people's ability to make their own choices and their ability to live with them. If you don't have anything nice or constructive to say, then don't.

Edited by krissy

Kristie and the Apex Agility Greyhounds: Kili (ATChC AgMCh Lakilanni Where Eagles Fly RN IP MSCDC MTRDC ExS Bronze ExJ Bronze ) and Kenna (Lakilanni Kiss The Sky RN MADC MJDC AGDC AGEx AGExJ). Waiting at the Bridge: Retired racer Summit (Bbf Dropout) May 5, 2005-Jan 30, 2019

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>>>about their dog doing zoomies in traffic because he slipped out a door>>>

 

You have a valid point, all dogs without exception should be taught recall daily. It once saved the life of one of my Borzois who had taken off towards a moorland road, I had trained a special tone of voice command which caused the dog to drop to the ground instantly. You never know when it might be needed.

 

I don't actually mind heartfelt pleas to keep greys on a lead, that's where they should be if you can't judge and handle the associated risks. Kind of like the extreme modern stupidity of not having toddlers on reins when they actually need to be.

 

On or off is always going to be a contentious issue of boards like this.

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I let mine off least in two scenarios (other than the backyard). First, in a fully fenced dog park or field. Second, when lure coursing. Otherwise, never, unless I am disentangling leashes. And even then, I'm unhappy. The fully enclosed field everyone is happy with. But lure coursing isn't fully enclosed, and I am relying on my dogs to have the drive to stay with the lure and not be distracted. Thus far, that's been the case, except once where Brandi didn't understand the game and did zoomies before wandering off to join a group for a picnic morning tea. Since then, no problems.

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It makes me sad that trust is compared to a disease. The problem is not the trust but the responsibility that comes with the trust. Our hounds can not tell us where their limits are. We have to look out for them, take the resposibility for their well-being and act in that way.

How can I demand from my dogs to trust me when I am not willing to trust them in return? Trust is not blind.

 

The day Colin and I stood in the backyard and watched a fat rabbit hop across the lawn and Colin did not run after it, he looked at it, looked at me, I looked at him and he still did not run was the day I decided to trust him off leash when we go for a walk. But not always and not everywhere.

I make the decision when and where he can walk off leash and I make the decision after considering the dangers.

 

I can understand both sides of this topic and it is always a question of the dog and the owner, where they live and many other circumstances.

Sorry for butchering the english language. I try to keep the mistakes to a minimum.

 

Nadine with Paddy (Zippy Mullane), Saoirse (Lizzie Be Nice), Abu (Cillowen Abu) and bridge angels Colin (Dessies Hero) and Andy (Riot Officer).

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I have had many (non grey) dogs who have gone off leash and were fine. They were totally uninterested in other dogs and had a great recall because they had literally grown up that way. They had been off leash since puppyhood (I am in a fairly rural/natural area) and it was no big deal...there was no way they were just going to randomly take off. The best behaved and most well adjusted dogs I know have all grown up this way. With greyhounds though, they sometimes see the offleash thing as "I'm free!!" and take off because they aren't used to it (combined with a strong instinct to run and chase). I think it depends on your dog, where you live (social norms), and what type of area you have for off-leashing. If I had a dog that was spooked by noises or didn't have a good recall I would never take a chance.

 

I know I can't trust Teague, but I also know that he NEEDS to have the chance to really run and be a greyhound. I am lucky in that I have several fenced in areas where he can burn off some steam 3-4 times per week. It does sound like your pup would benefit from off leash running, but you may want to ask around for some safe, fenced in areas to see how he does.

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I have been running a greyhound sanctuary in Ireland for more than 10 years and I have been very hands on with the dogs. Until recently I always took my dogs out running in small groups in vast open fields and never lost a dog - however, I was very strategic about it and it took a lot of hard work and forethought. I never ever lost a dog or had to go find one. Although I recently wrote a book about greyhounds as pets and have an entire chapter JUST on recall for off-leash time, I will give it to you in a nutshell here:

 

1) being off-leash is a privilege that you greyhound earns in a series of careful stages; it is not something you do all at once

 

2) start off with long-leashing (tracker leashing) your hound when in wide open areas; this is so that he gets some sense of freedom, but always staying with you...this can become his habit - do it in the same places all the time...this is so that when you DO begin to let him off leash, he knows the area, there are no surprises and he knows the routine. Great if you have a friend with you who has a dog who is reliable off leash.

 

3) at the same time you start long-leashing on walks, then at home start working on "bidding" - calling your dog to you by name and clapping you thigh when the dog is near you; from there, you can "graduate" up to "beckoning" - calling your dog to you by name and clapping you thigh when the dog is out of sight - maybe in the next room, or even further, such as out in the back yard and you are in the house. In both instances, when your dog does come to you, clap/pet his shoulder and back instead of your thigh...this will come in handy later

 

4) once your dog has bidding and beckoning well established, you are ready to stat experimenting with off-leash time step by step: at first, always at the end of long and tiring walk. Now, the problem here is that there are so many variations in how you might do this that it would take me an hour to write it all. But I think you get the picture....the first few times only a few minutes, calling his name and slapping your thigh or clapping your hands when you want him to come to you. NEVER start calling your greyhound in a panic the moment you let him off leash! Give him the chance to sniff around. You can also practice by letting him off leash in a very large enclosed field where he thinks he is totally loose.

 

Keep in mind that some will be better than others and the trick is to figure out where your greyhound's own boundaries are. You might find that he is only reliable at the end of a long walk on a certain secluded beach; someone else might find their greyhound is good off leash anywhere BUT once he is off leash for more than 20 minutes, he gets "wandery" and loses focus...someone else might find their geyhound is great off leash only around other dogs or a particular dog. Find out your dog's limitations.

 

Last - if you can't do the off leash training slowly and methodically, then don't bother at all. Even centuries ago the old books and treatises on greyhounds talked about how to train them for being off leash....which they were all the time....and the ones who always came back, who obeyed the huntsman's horn, were the ones our greyhounds today are descended from. They were deliberately bred to be biddable. If we approach off-leash training carefully, we can bring that "biddability" out in them.

 

Because I am a new member, I cannot post photos. When I am allowed, I will be glad to post photos of the dogs running in vast open fields.

 

It's not that THEY are "so bad" at recall, but that we have to be better at knowing how to teach it to them.

Thank you. That was a very insightful post. And a reminder to all of us in the US, that although we Americans are the majority of the online GT community, we didn't "discover" greyhounds. They've been thriving across the pond for a VERY long time, and we might have something to learn from those that keep them there.

 

Also - we should all try to note where a poster is from - norms are different depending on where we live. What might be taboo in the US might be a perfectly valid and workable situation elsewhere, with a little help and advice and support.

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Another member of the 'never' group....

 

Nancy...Mom to Sid (Peteles Tiger), Kibo (112 Carlota Galgos) and Joshi.  Missing Casey, Gomer, Mona, Penelope, BillieJean, Bandit, Nixon (Starz Sammie),  Ruby (Watch Me Dash) Nigel (Nigel), and especially little Mario, waiting at the Bridge.

 

 

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Guest DarkHorse

Wow. Rude and unnecessary much? I could say the EXACT same thing about not putting time and effort into recall training even when "my dog never goes off leash". Someone JUST posted about their dog doing zoomies in traffic because he slipped out a door. You can guilt trip me all you want about the fact that I off leash my dogs in reasonably safe places, but when my dogs slip out an open door or I drop a leash they come back when they are called. I've already said that not off leashing is a responsible choice if you're not going to make the effort to proof your recall. There are a lot of dogs out there that have no business being off leash, regardless of breed. But I don't GUILT TRIP anyone on here that they are going to be responsible for their dog's death as a result of a "poor decision" to not train something reasonably simple. Quite frankly, though, even with the additional calculated risks of being off leash I still think a dog with a 90% recall is safer than a dog that has poor recall and is never off leash... until it is by accident.

 

I would like to note that Dexter slipped out and did zoomies in traffic even after we'd been working on recall for years with him. He was 90% reliable in the situations we'd worked on, but we weren't comfortable with his recall in exactly the situation he got into - busy and loud space, people running at him, someone who had him all worked up with playing before he slipped out. I think working on recall with greyhounds is very important, but I don't think I'd trust any dog in that situation. Off-lead in other places deemed safe is entirely different.

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I don't think lukasmom's post was the least bit rude. I found the response to it bizarre and over-the-top, however.

 

I don't advocate any dog being off leash unless the dog is actively engaged in doing a job that requires it.

 

Teaching recall is great. It isn't worth much when the dog spooks or gets a wild hair and takes off -- exactly the situations where the best-trained dog ignores his/her fine training.

Star aka Starz Ovation (Ronco x Oneco Maggie*, litter #48538), Coco aka Low Key (Kiowa Mon Manny x Party Hardy, litter # 59881), and mom in Illinois
We miss Reko Batman (Trouper Zeke x Marque Louisiana), 11/15/95-6/29/06, Rocco the thistledown whippet, 04/29/93-10/14/08, Reko Zema (Mo Kick x Reko Princess), 8/16/98-4/18/10, the most beautiful girl in the whole USA, my good egg Joseph aka Won by a Nose (Oneco Cufflink x Buy Back), 09/22/2003-03/01/2013, and our gentle sweet Gidget (Digitizer, Dodgem by Design x Sobe Mulberry), 1/29/2006-11/22/2014, gone much too soon. Never forgetting CJC's Buckshot, 1/2/07-10/25/10.

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Guest CarryOnAMusing

I participate in the "never" camp but believe in the "know your dog" camp.

 

Most situations for me that are not fenced or indoors I'm going to want my dog at my side due to environmental dangers. And I see no reason to be off-lead if they're going to be so close constantly anyway. I'd personally rather have the failsafe.

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Personally, I am part of the never group. I think it's even in our adoption contracts (for at least one of the groups that I have worked with).

 

However, my shoes don't fit everyone, so I would offer the following to the good advice posted above: your grey will be a different dog in six or eight months than he is now. It takes a while for their personality to develop and shine through, and for them to learn to respond to you, and for you to learn how responsive they will be to you. I would wait at least that long if you are going to try it, and even then after training with the long lead, tired dog etc. GreyOrchard and others make some good tips above.

 

Then there's that feeling that we have experienced where a grey gets loose, and your heart falls to the bottom of the stomach as his eyes latch onto a squirrel across the street.

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I'm of the "it's never safe" camp too.

Tin and Michael and Lucas, Picasso, Hero, Oasis, Galina, Neizan, Enzo, Salvo and Noor the Galgos.
Remembering Bridge Angel Greyhounds: Tosca, Jamey, Master, Diego, and Ambi; plus Angel Galgos Jules, Marco and Baltasar.

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I can't think of a situation where I'd feel comfortable doing it, perhaps on a deserted island :). I agree very much that a lot of situations are a "know your dog" and know yourself and your situation. For example I've left my dogs in the car for a few minutes (on a cool non-summer day), and some people consider that a huge risk and even abusive. We all must pick and choose what feels safest to us while also realizing that unforeseen incidents can happen in just about any situation and we can only do our best to keep our loved pups safe while still allowing them to be dogs (e.g. I would let my dogs run in a big fenced field despite the possible risk of injury while running).

Edited by k9soul
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I am in the second Tuesday of next week camp. they tell the story of a greyhound at the Solvang greytfest, where a owner attached the leash to the metal part of one of those benches you see at the big box hardware stores, a bunch of wooden seat and seat back wooden slats, with two fancy wrought iron end pieces. they found the dog like 2 towns over 4 miles away STILL hauling the wrought iron part he was attached by the leash.

 

My adoptive group and pretty much everybody I talk with, says leash unless in an enclosed location.

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I don't think lukasmom's post was the least bit rude. I found the response to it bizarre and over-the-top, however.

 

I don't advocate any dog being off leash unless the dog is actively engaged in doing a job that requires it.

 

Teaching recall is great. It isn't worth much when the dog spooks or gets a wild hair and takes off -- exactly the situations where the best-trained dog ignores his/her fine training.

 

There are dogs not suited to being off leash. There are dogs that can be suited to it in the appropriate situations. I have never advocated that anyone ELSE off leash their dog. My point has always been that most dogs aren't going to have a constantly worked on recall that is appropriate to being given off leash privileges, but that does not mean that *greyhounds* in and of the fact that they are greyhounds cannot be. Considering most people feel that blanket statements aren't good, it's amazing how well this particular one has taken a deep hold. And that is fine in the sense that most dogs have no business being off leash, and maybe this is just an easier way to ensure that fact, but when it results in people of one opinion guilt tripping those who don't prescribe to that particular train of thought... that is not okay.

 

Regardless, of the off-leash debate, it is extremely rude to point blank suggest that someone is going to cause their dog's death. That wouldn't be appropriate in any situation, and the off leash/on leash debate is no exception. If you want to say that you don't feel comfortable with that for your own dogs, that is a very fair thing to say. If you want to say that it would give you a heart attack and you would always be worrying and so you won't do it, that's fair. If you want to say that if anything happened to your dog while it was off leash that YOU would feel responsible, that is fair. An opinion would be to say "I think it is safest to keep dogs on leash as a lot can happen when they're free, some of which is out of your control and it's always possible for something bad to happen, no matter how careful you are being" vs "I just pray that you never have to post a heartbreaking post that your dog met an untimely death that could have been prevented." That's not an opinion, it's a judgement, and it's uncalled for. If you want to think it in your head, that's fine, but there's no need to voice that. Everyone on this forum loves their dogs, and I'm sorry if you don't agree, but I think it's rude to suggest otherwise. Every single person on this forum is going to make different choices and decisions for their dog in all aspects of life, and no one has a right to judge those decisions (at least in written form, what happens in your head is your own business) whether they are about off leashing, treating or not treating for osteosarcoma, or feeding kibble vs. raw. We all make decisions for OUR dogs based on what we feel is best for them overall. We all take certain risks with our dogs that we have decided are acceptable to us given the benefits that the dogs receive from it. I might try to counsel someone that my opinion is that raw is not the best option to feed (just as an example, since I don't actually have a strong feeling on this particular topic) because of x, y, z. But it would be rude for me to tell them their dog is going to die a preventable death from food poisoning or intestinal obstruction because they decide to feed raw. It's not an opinion at that point. Hey, maybe I'm just overly sensitive, but I really don't think anyone here would appreciate that if it was turned around.

 

 

I would like to note that Dexter slipped out and did zoomies in traffic even after we'd been working on recall for years with him. He was 90% reliable in the situations we'd worked on, but we weren't comfortable with his recall in exactly the situation he got into - busy and loud space, people running at him, someone who had him all worked up with playing before he slipped out. I think working on recall with greyhounds is very important, but I don't think I'd trust any dog in that situation. Off-lead in other places deemed safe is entirely different.

 

No, of course not. It's never safe to let a dog off leash near traffic. And of course, even if you have a solid recall in other situations it can always fail. And of course there are always dogs that will not have as strong a recall under any circumstance. I simply used your example because it's a very common accident that everyone on here fears, and while recall may not work at least if you have one it's an option.

Edited by krissy

Kristie and the Apex Agility Greyhounds: Kili (ATChC AgMCh Lakilanni Where Eagles Fly RN IP MSCDC MTRDC ExS Bronze ExJ Bronze ) and Kenna (Lakilanni Kiss The Sky RN MADC MJDC AGDC AGEx AGExJ). Waiting at the Bridge: Retired racer Summit (Bbf Dropout) May 5, 2005-Jan 30, 2019

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Of my six I only let Harley off lead and that was at the country club where I worked when it was closed, on my friends ranch where there were fences acres away or at select places where directions began with "turn off the paved road".

Sometimes when my mind is wandering around I marvel at the difference in off lead acceptance in the US and UK. While I totally understand that they are sighthounds and hard wired to work on their own I sometimes wonder if the US upbringing might somehow make them less responsive to recall. Here they can be whelped on one farm, grow up on another, be sent to a finishing farm then go on to multiple tracks, trainers and kennel helpers. To the best of my knowledge that isn't how it works in the UK.

Edited by Hubcitypam
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We rarely use a leash regardless of the situation. I see the whole thing as very simple. It all comes down to what motivates the dog and the character of the dog. If the dog would rather be beside you then 100 yards away then you have a chance. If the dog is just as happy wandering off in the opposite direction than I wouldn't risk it. Take the dog to a fully enclosed area. Let it go and walk away. Does it follow you? When it runs, does it run around you or at you? Introduce other dogs. After checking them out does your dog come back to you? These are good signs. Good recall is nice to have but it is not enough to keep a dog safe. I feel safer with a dog that has a natural tendency to make the right decisions.

 

And before letting the dog go in an unfenced area the assumption is that the location is safe from traffic and dangerous terrain, and that you have spent a great deal of time bonding with your dog on long walks in many different locations (this can take months, maybe years).

 

And under all circumstances, anytime any dog is off leash there is a risk that it could end in tragedy. I have made the conscious choice that the risk is worth giving my dog greater freedom. If you can't accept this risk as a reality then don't do it.

 

I have posted these videos before on this forum. This is what I mean by the right character. The behaviours exhibited are in no way trained. "They are natural". In fact we don't do any training at all. My dog has never heard the word "heel" despite the video titles. This is just what he does.

 

https://youtu.be/u7PVpaplIfI

 

https://youtu.be/txIBV957OQU

Edited by KickReturn
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Opinions are judgments, by definition.

 

Hoping someone doesn't have a disaster isn't the same as suggesting that they will have one. The extreme reaction to a very simple statement is bizarre.

Star aka Starz Ovation (Ronco x Oneco Maggie*, litter #48538), Coco aka Low Key (Kiowa Mon Manny x Party Hardy, litter # 59881), and mom in Illinois
We miss Reko Batman (Trouper Zeke x Marque Louisiana), 11/15/95-6/29/06, Rocco the thistledown whippet, 04/29/93-10/14/08, Reko Zema (Mo Kick x Reko Princess), 8/16/98-4/18/10, the most beautiful girl in the whole USA, my good egg Joseph aka Won by a Nose (Oneco Cufflink x Buy Back), 09/22/2003-03/01/2013, and our gentle sweet Gidget (Digitizer, Dodgem by Design x Sobe Mulberry), 1/29/2006-11/22/2014, gone much too soon. Never forgetting CJC's Buckshot, 1/2/07-10/25/10.

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My first Greyhound, George, was a funny fellow. I've worked with dogs since I was old enough to walk--and George simply did not want to be trained. I joke and say that it was all about him, all the time. As if he knew he had already had a long, moderately successful career, and in retirement he CHOOSE to simply ignore me! Sure, I taught him to sit, and I taught him to lie down, but he would look me right in the eye, touch his butt down, then stand right back up. Almost as if he was daring me to do something about it. I admit to taking the easy way out and just giving up and being content that he walked really well on a leash, but our training never went anywhere.

 

My current dog, Buck, is very sensitive and I have managed to teach him sit and down. He mostly comes when called--indoors. But Buck is one of those semi-spooky hounds that I would never, ever, ever let off leash unless it was a fenced area. Not because he is a greyhound, but because things like a rock painted white or a bug landing on him freak him out beyond reason. He MIGHT come when he was called if he were off leash, but if a bug landed on him? He would bolt, and he would not look where he was going, and would no doubt meet an untimely end.

 

My dog before greyhounds was a mutt. I had him offleash all the time, in the city (at parks, but we were still in the city). He had excellent recall, because I worked on it for a full year before I dropped the long line. He was one of only two dogs at our little "dog park" that reliably came when called. The only time his recall failed was when he just HAD TO poke the "funny kitty" that was black with a white stripe down it's back....luckily the skunk punished him so I didn't even have to remind him that he needed to obey me!


Hamish-siggy1.jpg

Susan,  Hamish,  Mister Bigglesworth and Nikita Stanislav. Missing Ming, George, and Buck

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