New Food Causing Kidney Disease?

[Guest JsMom]

We've had a long journey to finding the right food for our 12 year old grey. We finally found one, they changed the formula.... Found another, it's been great, or so I thought...

 

He was always a bit big, although the vet never said he was concerned about his weight. Since we started this food, he has lost some weight and was looking good, handled summer great. (He usually has a couple of rough weeks of diarrhea and refusing food during summer, and of course is much less active. This has been the routine since we got him at 3 years old. This summer, he never refused food, had maybe one poop that was less than stellar, and has been more playful than he has been in years.)

 

I thought this food was perfect and was sad I hadn't found it sooner since he seems so happy. I took him to the vet for his annual exam/shots and found that he was down to 66 pounds! Down from 72 last year. That worries me.

 

Vet asked about increased water intake and I told him it hadn't changed, but now I'm realizing that it has increased quite a bit, just so gradually that I hadn't noticed.

 

We did blood work and a urine test and found protein in his urine. Vet wants to do another test to check creatinine levels.

 

Here's my real question: I assumed that it's old age and this is the beginning of the end. My grandfather died of kidney failure and the doctor told us it's a good way to go. I've started making peace and just hope he has a happy rest of his life, however long that is. And then it hit me: could his food be causing this?? Is it too late to reverse with a food change? What would I even change to? Or should I just accept that he's 12 and a half and it's life? I was fine with it being age, but if it's the food...

[greysmom]

If it's a commercial food, it's probably not "causing" the higher levels, though a higher salt content *could* be causing increased water intake. (Unless you have information that this food is involved with some sort of recall for the past 6 months or so.)

 

As for the weight loss, it could just be his weight is normalizing on this new food. He might need a bit more of it to maintain. Though if he was a tad overweight, his increased activity could be helping him slim down to a better weight.

 

Some people like seniors to carry a bit extra, just in case they do get sick. That way they have some leeway and don't get super skinny right away. But extra weight will impact arthritis and other old age diseases, so it's a balancing act.

[Guest JsMom]

I thought his weight was normalizing with the new food, but the loss is too extreme and I think it's continuing. :-(

 

The vet said it's protein losing kidney disease and possibly something else (hence the test for creatinine). I really don't want him to suffer and am afraid if we do anything other than letting nature take it's course he will. And yet there's a part of me that needs to be sure I'm not killing him with his food.

 

We had switched him to a grain free salmon formula years ago that I thought would help him, but he ended up with bloody diarrhea. Very scary, b/c I didn't even realize it was the food at first! So now I'm paranoid. And I love this boy so much and really don't want this to be it.

[tbhounds]

I think you meant to say your vet is running a UPC. What was the BUN and the Creatinine levels? I would also be curious to see how well he's concentrating his urine--urine specific gravity. Protein Losing neuropathy or Glomerulonephritis is not all that uncommon with our retired racers. It is to be taken seriously but, certain steps must be taken before determining if your hound truly has PLN. You first need to rule out an active infection. A culture would rule that out. Blood pressures should be taken. Then, technically a UPC should be run 3 times to get a true consistent number. If the UPC is truly elevated your vet will place your hound on a blood pressure medication to reduce the pressure on the kidneys-most likely enalapril. You may be instructed to start daily low dose aspirin to reduce the chance of a stroke. Please don't confuse this with chronic renal failure. May I ask what the protein percentage is of his current kibble?

[Guest JsMom]

No idea what the numbers are.... We didn't get a full report yet. Crude protein is listed as 36%. It's Nature's Logic Beef formula.

[tbhounds]

Well IMHO 36% protein is awful high to feed a senior.

[JohnF]

Treatment of CRF depoends upon reducing the stress on remaining kidney function so the eaiser the food is for the body to handle the longer the quality of life period can be extended. Once your vet has all the figures try Royal Canin Veterinary Renal Diet... that firm know how to make ill-dog food tasty enough to eat.

 

For plenty of info from a high volume list visit:

[MaryJane]

No idea what the numbers are.... We didn't get a full report yet. Crude protein is listed as 36%. It's Nature's Logic Beef formula.

 

 

I agree, the protein is too high for a senior. Find a dog food that has about 20% protein or so and try that for awhile. Better yet, try a commercially available kidney diet.

 

If you feed more protein then a dog can handle, then some will be excreted by the kidneys and would be found in the urine. If you keep on feeding a high protein to a dog that is excreting protein, then this can cause additional damage to the kidneys as it damages the filtrating mechanism (this takes some time though). The kidneys can theoretically excrete a certain amount (filtration rate) while it is cleaning the blood.

[Burpdog]

12 1/2 is not old. I would not feed a senior 36% protein however (I would not feed my younger ones that high a protein either)

 

Any good senior food he will eat should be fine Some that come to mind that are not senior but fit into the parameters are Solid Gold Mmellenia, Solid Gold Hundeflocken, Annamet reduced fat, Prairie beef or chicken, BilJac kibble and BilJac frozen.

[PatricksMom]

Yes, I switched Patrick to a grain-free, fish based food to try to up the omega-3s for his arthritis. His previously borderline high for a greyhound kidney levels worsened (I don't remember the specifics), I put him back on his previous food, they went right back down. It's certainly worth a shot.

[Guest JsMom]

Wow, thanks for all the replies/perspective. Here, the rescues consider 9 "senior" and even the vet doesn't seem to think we should expect too much more time with him, just based on his age.

 

I had him on Solid Gold Mmillenia before, but he started refusing it. Most others have poultry of some kind that seems to make him itch. If I want to reduce his protein intake and not switch food, could it make sense to feed him less kibble and add in rice instead?

 

I will check out the link and other foods recommended, but I thought I'd ask...

[JohnF]

The link I posted for the K9 Kidney Group on Yahoo didn't work.

 

As it is such a helpful resource for kidney dogs, here it is again.

 

https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/K9KIDNEYS/info

Edited October 7, 2014 by JohnF

[GeorgeofNE]

No dog needs 36% protein unless they're actively working at something--racing, herding, etc.

 

Your vet is leaping to kidney failure without several critically important numbers--and if your vet is unaware that Greyhounds have different chemistry values, they may be way off base.

 

Could someone post that "Greyhounds are different" link for this person to give their vet?

[JohnF]

No dog needs 36% protein unless they're actively working at something--racing, herding, etc.

I don't even feed Peggy as much as 20% or it sets off all kinds of issues. (Duck and Brown Rice 18.5% she's on now)

 

And here's a link to that important Greyhound Health Packet

[PatricksMom]

Wow, thanks for all the replies/perspective. Here, the rescues consider 9 "senior" and even the vet doesn't seem to think we should expect too much more time with him, just based on his age.

I'm not sure where you are but lots of us have had greys live well into the teens

[Burpdog]

 

Wow, thanks for all the replies/perspective. Here, the rescues consider 9 "senior" and even the vet doesn't seem to think we should expect too much more time with him, just based on his age.

Is your vet familiar with greyhounds? Where are you located?

 

I've had many live into their teens.

 

 

[cometdust1]

I hope my boy lives into his teens; my first three didn't even make it to 10.

[Guest JsMom]

I'm going to switch his food... How much time should it take to see his weight come back up to know if it's the food and to retest?

[JohnF]

Switch the food gradually over 10 days. You should see some of the weight returning after about 3 weeks. It's nice to be able to see just the last two back ribs.

[Batmom]

The food itself isn't likely to make your dog lose weight. You may have to feed more of a given food to keep his weight steady.

 

If your dog has a protein-losing disorder, most times you do want to feed a reduced protein diet. But, you want to make sure he has a disorder before you go too low. Did that UPC test come back? Was the urine checked and double-checked for infection?

 

There's nothing wrong with feeding a healthy dog a high protein diet. Doesn't matter how old the dog is. It doesn't wear out the kidneys or damage them. Seniors (assuming healthy ones) tend to benefit from MORE protein, not less, because they don't process it as efficiently.

 

Hope any new tests have shed more light on the situation and that it's something easily managed.

[Guest sirsmom]

we switched my senior lab mix to science diet longevity and she really likes it. It's 20% protein. We give her bits of hamburger, egg, and meat from our plates over the day and she is thriving. I see quite a difference.

[Guest mykids]

Ask your Vet about Hills Prescription diet food. My greyhound is 10.5 years and the vet recommended KD diet 3 years ago because she was borderline for kidney disease. I have had good results with the Prescription diet, my other dog has colitis and he's on the ID diet.

[Guest JsMom]

Just wanted to thank everyone for their helpful information and add an update. Last night his back legs nearly collapsed during his walk. It took several minutes to stabilize him so he could support his weight again. It happened a couple of times before we got him settled in bed and gave him a Benadryl. (My husband suspected an ant bite at first.) This same thing happened a few weeks ago when it appeared he was bitten by an ant and he was fine after. Except that we have noticed him stumbling a bit and having his rear leg give out for a second before he quickly recovers.

 

So I did some research and it appears that LS can be associated with renal disease. I'm not holding out much hope for a recovery. He was okay today but slow and stiff (and happy) on the morning walk and hasn't moved much otherwise. Eating well, b/c we are switching to raw.

 

If anyone has experience with this to share, I'm grateful. I don't know how long we have, but with this going on I will not be taking him back to the vet. Getting in the car and the ride itself are too much, not to mention the vet office once we get in there.

[tbhounds]

You assume this is recent episode is LS related when it in fact could be a clot. Intermittent lameness and collapse can be a stroke/clot and have nothing to do with LS. One thing you can do is check your hounds urine looking for protein.

[omyability]

Lots of new research on dogs and kidneys and my holistic vet always told me that seniors need more protein, but a protein that digests well and to look for foods that have no by products, corn, or ingredients that are hard on the kidneys. I settled on Fromm a few years ago and it seems to work for the dogs I have now. Buffalo may be better than beef. I supplement with fresh chicken and sweet potatoes and carrots. I use Nature's Logic canned food. It is a really good food.