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Rayne Clinical Nutrition - Opinions?


Rickiesmom
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Background

Jaynie suffered very serious acute kidney failure in the fall of 2009. She almost died. Suspected cause, since everything else tested negative, was a reaction to an injected loading dose of Metacam post-spay.

Since that time she has been, at the recommendation of her now-retired internal medicine vet, on Royal Canin's Reduced Protein Diet, which I have supplemented with his blessing with one egg per day, or less egg and some lamb tripe (lowest in phosphorus).

Whatever you think of prescription foods, she has done very well, and her kidney values, with the exception of her creatinine (high even for a greyhound) have been good. It was at 215 before the amp (reference range 40 - 141 or 50 - 150, depending on which of 2 labs were doing the test). Prior to the kidney failure it had been normal. It was 743 when she was admitted to the specialty hospital in 2009.

Ever since her front leg amputation in April, her creatinine values have been up and down. Initially way down to 131 , and the thought was that because she had lost a leg and shoulder, she had less muscle mass, and so less muscle waste product. It crept up again, as high as 169 - not terrible, but the wrong direction. Yesterday it was back down to 131.

In spite of this her kidneys are not normal. On both an ultrasound and MRI done in the last few months, they were described as small and irregular, which is consistent with kidney disease. I am thrilled that her kidneys seem stable, and don't want to do anything to trigger any deterioration.

The dilemma

We decided to go the holistic treatment route after finishing chemo, and the integrative practice vet we are seeing has suggested the Rayne middle protein level food for her. I only feed dry. He feels the phosphorus level is OK for her, and that this is a more wholesome, more nutritious food. And that she will benefit, including her kidney health, with more protein than the low protein diet offers.

I am in a quandary about what to do. Part of me doesn't want to mess with success. The other part thinks this food looks healthier, albeit about double the protein and phosphorus (the complete analysis can be found on the links above):

 

Grams / 1000 kcal

 

Protein:

 

Royal Canin 34.2

Rayne RSS 64.3

 

Phosphorus:

 

Royal Canin 0.9

Rayne RSS 2.1

I would be interested in opinions about the suggested strategy in general, and this food in particular. Thank you!

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Thank you. Just to explain things a bit better - I am keenly aware of what's in the Royal Canin food, and also aware of multiple (and sometimes conflicting) dog food review sites. We know prescription food ingredients are not what we would normally choose, but when the chips are down, those diets work. The Royal Canin was the best among the prescription diets that were available, including Science Diet and Purina. I say this only because I don't want this thread to become about the ingredients in the food she is currently on. In fact if I stick with very low protein, Rayne has a lower protein diet than the one highlighted in this thread.

Rather, I am trying to learn, especially from those with renal dog experience, what you think about making this big a jump in the protein and phosphorus levels Jaynie is currently consuming. I would certainly introduce it gradually and monitor her renal values. By "regular" food standards the levels are still relatively low in the Rayne food but they are way higher than what she is consuming now, even allowing for additions I make.

The other thing I am very interested to know is what people think about this specific Rayne food in-and-of itself. I thought, for example, it had a lot of potato?

We just moved to a new internal med vet and I will be making an appointment with him to discuss this, and it is so helpful to have a range of thoughts and opinions in putting together a list of questions and concerns.

 

Thank you so much.

Edited by Rickiesmom
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What's her BUN?

Star aka Starz Ovation (Ronco x Oneco Maggie*, litter #48538), Coco aka Low Key (Kiowa Mon Manny x Party Hardy, litter # 59881), and mom in Illinois
We miss Reko Batman (Trouper Zeke x Marque Louisiana), 11/15/95-6/29/06, Rocco the thistledown whippet, 04/29/93-10/14/08, Reko Zema (Mo Kick x Reko Princess), 8/16/98-4/18/10, the most beautiful girl in the whole USA, my good egg Joseph aka Won by a Nose (Oneco Cufflink x Buy Back), 09/22/2003-03/01/2013, and our gentle sweet Gidget (Digitizer, Dodgem by Design x Sobe Mulberry), 1/29/2006-11/22/2014, gone much too soon. Never forgetting CJC's Buckshot, 1/2/07-10/25/10.

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It's not on the profile. The lab at the university has run her last few tests and there is a bunch of stuff on the reports I am not familiar with, but BUN is not there.

 

That said, it has been normal for a long time.

 

The last test I have from the lab local clinics use is from June 4 and at that time her BUN was 6.3 (reference range is 2.1 - 11.1). Unless it changed since then recently, it has been around that same value for a very long time.

 

I'll have the next renal panel run at the local lab (Antech).

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If her creatinine and BUN are within range or not far above, I'd think you could feed most any low- to moderate-protein/phosphorus food. But .... I would have a strong preference for doing as you're currently doing -- feeding a kibble you know she does well on and supplementing that with highly usable protein (your egg, tripe, etc.), as you're doing. That's likely going to provide better nourishment for her than changing the diet to an all-dry one.

Star aka Starz Ovation (Ronco x Oneco Maggie*, litter #48538), Coco aka Low Key (Kiowa Mon Manny x Party Hardy, litter # 59881), and mom in Illinois
We miss Reko Batman (Trouper Zeke x Marque Louisiana), 11/15/95-6/29/06, Rocco the thistledown whippet, 04/29/93-10/14/08, Reko Zema (Mo Kick x Reko Princess), 8/16/98-4/18/10, the most beautiful girl in the whole USA, my good egg Joseph aka Won by a Nose (Oneco Cufflink x Buy Back), 09/22/2003-03/01/2013, and our gentle sweet Gidget (Digitizer, Dodgem by Design x Sobe Mulberry), 1/29/2006-11/22/2014, gone much too soon. Never forgetting CJC's Buckshot, 1/2/07-10/25/10.

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  • 2 weeks later...

I didn't change. I decided to do as Batmom suggested and stick to the low protein diet with additional protein I supplied. I did look at the Rayne low protein food as an alternative to the Royal Canin, but it's only available in canned, which is not practical.

FWIW, if you live in the US, Just Food For Dogs is probably worth a look.

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Just fyi, I too agree that the ingredients in some of the vet prescription foods seem awful, to put it bluntly. However, we had a grey who was diagnosed with kidney disease not long after we adopted him at age 3. The vet recommended the prescription food and that is what he was on his entire life. Occasionally I would try to find a somewhat comparable (re: phosphorus/protein) commercial food, and I never could (and the vet also said there were other things in the rx diet that helped the kidneys).

 

He never had any tummy trouble, his stool was perfect (unlike the rest of our greys) and he lived past his 14th birthday and we had to let him go last September due to mobility issues, not kidney failure. Realize every dog is different, but I think there is something to the vet prescriptions. We now have a grey with EPI symptoms (I say symptoms as the vet has not done any tests other than standard bloodwork, which showed his enzymes were low), he's got the symptoms (had lost a lot of weight, had constant bacteria in loose stool, etc.) and we are trying to find the "right" food for him. I've looked at the recommendations on EPI-related websites, but after this last bout of bacteria and the vet very strongly insisting that we have no idea of the quality controls, etc. in these various "holistic" foods, I decided, reluctantly, to give the prescription diet a try (Hill's I/D low fat, formulated for dogs with EPI, pancreatitis, etc.). When I look at the ingredients, I can't understand how a dog can exist and grow and be healthy by eating this, and it is gnawing at me, yet I know how well our kidney guy did on rx diet. So I am going to give it a try and then if it works great, perhaps supplement with some boiled chicken or something a little "healthier", to my mind.

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