Advice Needed For 12.5 Yr Old With Ccd

[Guest Energy11]

Hello Everyone. It has been a long time since I have been on here. I thought I'd pick the brains of those who have had greyhounds with bad CCD (doggie Alzhiemers).

 

Oakly, 12.5, is in great health for his age. All blood work is good. During the day, he is pretty much normal for Oakly. (*He has always been a very hyper greyhound... jumping and barking, etc). He goes out with the others, Curfew also 12.5, Classy, 5, and Sheila 6. He sleeps a lot, but not really more than his 12.5 yr old brother. He DOES pant almost all the time when he is awake (*use Metacam for arthritis, along with joint supplements and Sam-e for increased mental clarity).

 

Beginning about 2-3 a.m., even after getting either Valuim or Xanax about 1 hour earlier, he will wake up like a shot, ask to go out, which is fine, but after that, it is barking, pacing from one end of the house to the other, trying to "wake" my husband or I up (*we pretend to be asleep). Last night, during his pacing, he went in to my husband's room and apparently stepped on one of the girls who bit him within 1/4 inch of his eye! We now baby gate him in the living room where I now sleep. He will continue this with hyperness, panting, barking, pacing, for hours until he is fed. If you grab his collar or try to subdue him, he will try to bite. We used to feed around 6 a.m., but now, the only way to settle Oakly down is to feed him whether it be 3, 4, 5, a.m. Last night, it was 3 a.m. After he eats, it takes a while for him to settle, but he eventually will settle and go back to sleep.

 

My husband and I are both retired and in our 60s, but we are exhausted beyond belief. We do NOT believe in putting an animal down because he/she is inconveniencing us. But, we wonder if Oakly is miserable in his own skin and now, he is becoming a danger to himself around the others.

 

We have tries all the natural remedies, and we have tried Valium and Xanax, per his vet, to try to keep him sedate during the nights. We were thinking of Anipryl, but we used it on our Goldie and once on a 13 yr old boy, Dasher, and it really seemed to make them worse. Any help, advice, ideas about how to deal with Oakly and this disease will be greatly appreciated. I would definitely like to hear about anyone else's experiences with Anipryl.

 

Thank you! Dee

[Guest FordRacingRon]

Sounds like my 11 year old I started a thread about this because I too thought she had CCD. Virtually everything she does is what your dog currently does (we are in our 60s too and are also wiped out). LAst night I got the 1230am to130am shift with our pacer.

 

My dog is her normal self during the day but at 5 pm the switch gets thrown, the panting starts and the hyperactivity.

 

All I can say is,,we took her for almost 3K worth of tests. The rule of thumb ws/is, since there is no definitive proof a dog has CCD, everything else must be eliminated. We started her on Anipryl while she was going through tests. We saw an internist, a cardiologist (and CTs with both of them),,a complete blood workup and finally a visit with a neurologist. We too were using Valium but as one of the vets told us, the Valium will become pretty ineffective and it did. Eventually it was decided she did not have CCD and no reason for an MRI of the brain so the very last words from the neurologist was,,,"this may just be the way our dog is handling old age". BTW,,the Anipryl did do nothing but maybe because she doesn't really have CCD.

 

The only thing we have found that somewhat works is Trazadone. Leia does not seem to build up an immunity for it so when she starts to get going we dose her with a Trazadone.

 

The advice you will get here will be a lot of absorb but my contribution for the hyperactivity is Trazadone. I even dose her in the middle of the night , like last night,,if she goes off the rails.

[Guest Energy11]

Thank you for your advice and information! I am a retired paramedic and I do know about Trazadone. I will definintely mention it to our vet, who is a real sweetie. He comes to our house to see our old boys, because I do not want to stress them by taking them into the office. We actually moved closer to his practice when our lease was up.

 

I have had a lot of experience with human Alzhiemers patients and Oakly seems to be just like them. The night time hyperactivity is like the human "Sundowners Syndrome" in humans. All we can do is try to get sleep where we can and try different things to help Oakly.

[Fiona3]

We have a yellow lab who is 13-1/2 years old who is exhibiting much of the behavior listed. When the barking during the night became more frequent in recent weeks, we took him to our vet for a thorough work up. He has been placed on Denosyl twice a day and has been started on a prescription diet of Hills b/d Healthy Aging & Alertness for cognitive issues.

 

A big part of the problem is that he has Sundowners Syndrome and becomes restless around 5-6 pm, starts barking and pacing aimlessly and seems disoriented. When this begins, I engage him with a stuffed toy or his ball to keep his attention focused. I've been able to get him to lie down on the rug while I rub him and talk to him. Eventually he seems to calm down and relax.

 

The biggest step forward has been leaving a light on in whichever room he has chosen to sleep. The first night he amazed us when he went until 4:00 without barking. Each night he has gotten progressively better and now rarely barks at night.

 

I know the exhausted feeling you are talking about. We are also in our 60s and getting just a few hours of sleep was difficult to handle.

 

Bailey has been showing small signs of improvement. Although they are little things, we feel encouraged by the subtle changes we are seeing.

 

Good luck with your pup.

[tbhounds]

I was also going to recomend feeding Hills B/D (brain diet).

[Guest FordRacingRon]

I was also going to recomend feeding Hills B/D (brain diet).

PS: Leia was on this too,,but to no effect. However as I stated,,she probably doesn't really have CCD. As I mentioned,,the game changer was the Trazadone,,which by the way i pick up at Walgreen's. There was another supplement called Neutricks that our vet recommended,,,also no affect but again, probably I do not really have a CCD dog,,just one with most of the symptoms. Although Neutricks is just recommended for older dogs, you can get it on Amazon.

 

BTW,,the neurologist said to come back if she ever gets stuck in a corner or starts doing her business in the house because then we have a problem. But she does neither of those.

[Guest Energy11]

Thank you for your ideas and comments. I tried BD on our Goldie and it did nothing for her, and I am not a fan of the Science Diet RX products, except, I do like and use their ID canned when we have bowel issues. I am definitely going to talk to his vet tomorrow about the Trazadone. I know about the drug and have done some research since reading about it on here. I am not looking forward to another night, tonight.

[GeorgeofNE]

Dee,

 

Please take this for what it is--a comment in reply for your request for suggestions/advice from a grown woman who watched her father slip into complete and total senility.

 

What would YOU want? If every night you lost control of yourself and spiraled into what sure sounds like distress? With virtually no hope that it will ever get better?

 

I know that if we had been able to give my Dad the relief of being put to "sleep," we surely would have. In the end, all we could do was pray that it wouldn't last one more night.

 

Maybe have a heart to heart with your spouse and consider what you'd want if you had the option of NOT suffering through it. Like your dear boy does.

 

That is all. And best wishes whatever you decide.

[silverfish]

I've not had a dog dxd with CCD, but I've had to leave a nightlight on for one of them when he got older to keep him happy - without it he did a lot of wandering around at night. It's simple, inexpensive and definitely worth a try. We had one large, low wattage lamp which lit the kitchen/lounge and partly lit the hallway and dining room was enough for Jack. Depending on your dog and the layout of your house, you may want more than one, but do give it a shot. It could be that he doesn't hear and see so well these days and he finds the dark unsettling. I think that was Jack's problem.

 

Another thing worth a shot is the Adaptil diffuser. It's just a pheromone based calming fluid which diffuses through the air and can help to soothe an anxious dog.

 

I hope you find an answer. It all sounds very stressful.

[Batmom]

Doesn't sound like CCD at all. Sounds like his tummy hurts (and maybe some other things, but at least that).

 

It is very common for a dog in pain to seem OK during the day yet be unable to settle or wakeful at night.

 

If he's on Metacam, he needs to be on a stomach protectant as well.

 

I'd get that stomach protectant started -- or switch to something different if you're already using one; feed a before-bed snack; and have a snack or meal ready for him if he's still getting up at night.

[Guest FordRacingRon]

Thank you for your ideas and comments. I tried BD on our Goldie and it did nothing for her, and I am not a fan of the Science Diet RX products, except, I do like and use their ID canned when we have bowel issues. I am definitely going to talk to his vet tomorrow about the Trazadone. I know about the drug and have done some research since reading about it on here. I am not looking forward to another night, tonight.

Something I forgot with the Traz,,,when we put Leia on the Anipryl we HAD to stop the Traz because of drug interaction seeing how both re really anti-antidepressants that conflict with each other. But Valium or Xanax did not,,that is why we switched to the Valium. When after a month (at the neurologists suggestion) the Anipryl did nothing we went back to the Trazadone.

 

My shift last night was 1245 to 2 am.

PS: If you haven't seen a neurologist I would consider that. As I found out CCD is very hard to diagnose and you have to eliminate everything else. I never thought I would go that route but I seriously spent over 3K in tests to find out we still have not idea why my dog is this way. Also,,we though Rimadyl would help if she was in the type of pain that can help,,it didn't. After all the test I honestly think my dog has a form if IBS but I cannot afford to go back to the internist we saw for more tests.

[FiveRoooooers]

Dee, please do try leaving a night light on. A simple holiday window candle throws enough light to break the darkness yet it doesn't seem to interfere with sleep (mine!). Good luck!

[Guest missecho]

Is there some problem with feeding him before he goes to sleep, say, 10ish? Have you tried giving him more food? Maybe he is really hungry for some reason.

 

Every night part of bedtime routine is "midnight treat", a piece or two of chicken, which spurs Molly into finishing the remains of her dinner. Then she beds down.

[Guest Energy11]

Something I forgot with the Traz,,,when we put Leia on the Anipryl we HAD to stop the Traz because of drug interaction seeing how both re really anti-antidepressants that conflict with each other. But Valium or Xanax did not,,that is why we switched to the Valium. When after a month (at the neurologists suggestion) the Anipryl did nothing we went back to the Trazadone.

 

My shift last night was 1245 to 2 am.

PS: If you haven't seen a neurologist I would consider that. As I found out CCD is very hard to diagnose and you have to eliminate everything else. I never thought I would go that route but I seriously spent over 3K in tests to find out we still have not idea why my dog is this way. Also,,we though Rimadyl would help if she was in the type of pain that can help,,it didn't. After all the test I honestly think my dog has a form if IBS but I cannot afford to go back to the internist we saw for more tests.

I have a call into the vet today about trying the Trazadone. I was pretty sure you couldn't mix the Traz and the Anipryl as it is a MAO inhibitor. You can give hardly anything with those. Oakly did MUCH better last nigh with hubby sleeping out here, so we shall see. It was also hard to evaluate him last night due to an ALL NIGHT thunder and rain storm!!! Just what we all needed. Thanks for your continuing help and advice. Dee

[Guest Energy11]

Thanks to all of your for your advice and comments. I know exactly what this disease is, how it works, etc., but it is never easy. Oakly started his Trazadone last night with one valium. He was better. ... We will take it day by day. The vet seems hopeful at this point. We leave lights on, soft music, etc., but when he gets "out there" for lack of better wording, no one can get to him. He barks and jumps and tries to bite (*especially my husband who ususally feeds him). I can distract him, but it is always with food. Believe me, this boy gets plenty of treats all day and before bed.

 

I pray the Trazadone helps him, as I will not let him suffer. .... Dee

[Rickiesmom]

Dee, no suggestions, just

[Batmom]

For others reading:

 

It isn't possible to know "exactly what this disease is, how it works, etc." The specialists don't know that.

 

Most dogs who have night restlessness are responding to some type of physical discomfort and/or vision or hearing changes.

 

There are many reasons that older dogs in particular are restless at night. It is wise to rule out pain, hunger, temperature issues (elderly dogs are less able to respond to temperature changes), response to noises outdoors or in, urinary tract infection / bladder stones .....

[robinw]

I assume urinary infections, bladder infections, etc. have been ruled out?

[Guest FordRacingRon]

For others reading:

 

It isn't possible to know "exactly what this disease is, how it works, etc." The specialists don't know that.

 

Most dogs who have night restlessness are responding to some type of physical discomfort and/or vision or hearing changes.

 

There are many reasons that older dogs in particular are restless at night. It is wise to rule out pain, hunger, temperature issues (elderly dogs are less able to respond to temperature changes), response to noises outdoors or in, urinary tract infection / bladder stones .....

I almost begin to wonder if my dog just doesn't feel comfortable without someone in the room with her. Although I think temperature has a lot to do with it, she starts the night in the hallway right outside our bedroom. I finally figured out it is when she wakes from that nap,,at whatever time,,is when she starts the barking/pacing. I get up and go into the living room with her and tell her to be quite a few times and she will settle and sleep. If i go back to be too soon(before she is asleep) she is at it again. If I wait until she is sleeping well,,I get to go back and stay in bed. The only flaw to that is, why doesn't she just sleep in the bedroom with us in her bed.

[Batmom]

Ron, now that is a question that no one but lovely Leia can answer. FWIW, my 5 year old does something similar.

[Guest Energy11]

For those asking, yes, everything has been ruled out as far as we know.

 

Oakly hates summer and heat. So, we keep the AC down just for him and my other senior. I keep a small light on, sleep in the same room with him, etc. We have baby gated off some of his "pacing space," which also seems to help. We started Trazadone four days ago. Just one about 30 min before bedtime. It has really helped him, and has worked wonders. We do need to keep everything routine, and when we do, he is good. He falls asleep and stays asleep until he has to potty, or if it is time to eat.. He is as normal as my other 12.5 yr old during the day.

 

We are retired, so I am lucky I can spend time trying to help him and figure out his "demons." He is eating well. Pottying well, listens, knows his name, etc. We take each day at a time here.

[Remolacha]

I haven't responded because i have nothing useful to offer but I did want to say I am glad the new meds are helping him!

[carronstar]

That is a good update!

[Guest Energy11]

Hello all.

 

Oakly has been on Trazadone for about two weeks now. He is actually doing quite well! At about 11:15, I give 1.5 tablets, and then they all go out for their "last call," which doesn't always mean, "last call" with seniors. Most nights, he sleeps pretty well, and one night, he slept straight through from 111:30 p-6:00a, when he woke to eat with the rest. He does wander a bit at night, and some nights are better than others. Last night, he was up and down, wandering with a little barking, until about 2 p.m. I gave a 10 mg Valium, and it helped him settle down till breakfast time. (*Vet okayed Valium with the Trazadone).

 

For the most part, though, I am pleased that Oakly is having better nights for him, as well as for us and the other dogs. He seems happier during the day, and is awake a lot more We are FINALLY getting cooler weather, and the humidity is finally breaking, so that makes for a better rest as well. AC or not, the seniors feel the heat.

 

Thanks to all of you for the advice and help! Dee, Curfew, Oakly, Sheila and Classy (*newer girls, ages 6 &5).

[Remolacha]

Glad to hear Oakly is doing better! I am sure the cooler, dryer weather must be a help too. You are so right that the heat bothers the old ones even with AC.