Corns

[christinepi]

When we got Tracker, he needed surgery for a race track injury. One of his front toes needed amputation. After the surgery, the vet said he was likely to limp on that leg somewhat for the rest of his life. He has limped, on and off, for the time we've had him (3 years now). The last 2 months it's gotten increasingly pronounced (not non stop, but often enough). So I took him to the vet and she x-rayed him; all normal, no arthritis, no cancer. However, he has a corn in that same foot, more specifically, in the toe next to the amputated one, and he showed a reaction to having that particular toe pad squeezed. She suggested to put him on Rimadyl, (and Tramadol, if necessary), for 10 days, and see whether that would make the limp go away. She said this also could be a ligament that may have been torn/inflamed.

 

She said she'd remove the corn surgically, if in 10 days this can be identified as the problem (with the caveat it'll likely come back).

 

Now I've never had a dog before, with corns or without, so I started snooping around this forum. It seems there's zero need to remove corns surgically, but that they can be hulled, even at home. So that doesn't make me happy about this vet at this point (this was my first visit with her, though I liked her personally. And she is Greyhound savvy, at least). Another unanswered question right know (I didn't think to ask when in the office--all these questions always pop up after one leaves): would painkiller actually help with what feels like a rock in one's shoe? I imagine it could, but it seems like a different kind of situation, compared to, say, an inflammation or tooth pain. But I may be totally wrong on this.

 

I went to FB Greyhounds with Corns, but haven't read much yet. I learned about creams, and Therapaws.

 

My questions: Tracker has reacted very badly to Fentanyl in the past, and while Tramadol, according to the vet, is an opioid, it's doesn't quite act like Fentanyl. I should just try one, and if he gets all anxious and loopy, just stick with the Rimadyl. Does that sound reasonable?

 

And secondly: should I strongly resist her suggestion to have the corn surgically removed, if it comes to that, or are there ever situations when surgery is justified? His doesn't even stick out or look bad, if that's anything to go by. It's just a little lighter in color than the rest of the pad and totally even it.

 

 

[MandysMom]

My angel Mandy suffered from corns on all four paws. it was not fun. I would not have considered surgery. I did have them hulled frequently. You can find good information about corns here: Grassmere.

 

The things that worked best for Mandy (remember that every dog is different):

• Keeping her nails SUPER short
• Keeping her paw pads well moisturized (use plain vaseline and cover with toddler socks a couple of times a day -- be sure the socks won't be eaten)
• Having the corns hulled
• Using Therapaws religiously when outside
• Tramadol in a low dose (she tolerated it well)

If it were me, I wouldn't want the surgery. I've heard too many people say the corns came back almost immediately. I tried some of the other treatments (Abreva, bee propolis, etc), but none seemed to do any better than plain vaseline applied daily.

 

You said he did badly with Fentanyl. Tramadol is different. I'd go with your vet's suggestion. Tramadol can be used with Rimadyl.

 

Best of luck with Tracker. There is also a Yahoo Group "Corn Hounds" (I am not on Facebook).

Edited September 18, 2013 by MandysMom

[MaryJane]

Two of my dogs have corns and I would never have surgery on them. I hull them with a dremel and put cream on them.

 

You especially don't want surgery since the toe next to it was amputated and that could cause additional problems with shifting weight and with that, the possibility of then having corns spring up on other toes ....

[Hubcitypam]

My Rex had corns surgically removed from all four paws. I would NEVER do that to a dog again. The healing is painful and they just come right back. I had good luck with duct tape and a lot have had great success with hulling.

[dmdsmoxie]

I usually stay out of these conversations because there are many that know more than me about corns. However, I don't understand this;

 

She said she'd remove the corn surgically, if in 10 days this can be identified as the problem (with the caveat it'll likely come back).

 

Why not just get in hulled and see if that is the problem instead of putting him on meds?

 

Dick

[christinepi]

Dick, I hear you. That's exactly what I thought after I started looking into this. It seems like a no brainer. She could have hulled him on the spot. Why give him meds unnecessarily?

 

I took him to this specialist today because that's where he had the original surgery done. She has her office 35 minutes away (we live in a rural area). We have a local vet 10 minutes from us, but I have no clue how good she is about hulling--since only Greyhounds get corns--I only learned that today-- would she have the experience? I'll have to ask.

 

Now I really don't know what to do. No surgery for the corn, for sure, but the meds?

Edited September 18, 2013 by christinepi

[Hubcitypam]

I have found many non greyhound vets are willing to learn. Maybe print this off and ask the local vet about it?

http://www.grassmere-animal-hospital.com/corn_hulling.htm

[Rickiesmom]

My whippet has corns. I e-mailed my vet the link to the Grassmere article and asked him to hull them.

 

He was very reluctant at first, expecting blood to flow at any moment, but he did it, and was super-impressed with how well the process worked. So much so the next time Rickie needed it done one of the other vets did it and another came in to watch and learn. It's pretty much a maintenance procedure but much better than surgery which, like many have said already, I would not consider as it doesn't have a good track record.

 

I now do it myself, but that isn't for everyone.

[tbhounds]

Just going to throw this out here. I have had surgery performed to remove corns on one of mine (she has since past)-they never returned. We have also performed the same surgery in our clinic last year on another gh (GT member too) and just now (12 months later) one or two may have returned-this dog last year was absolutely cripple-he could not walk--he is now sound and for the entire last year he was able to be a happy pain free boy. To be completely honest I believe the success of the surgery lies in the capability of the surgeon.

[Neighsayer]

Do more reading on the Facebook page. There are links to hulling videos. You can probably do it yourself. I haven't heard many success stories from surgical removal. Good luck!

[Hubcitypam]

To be completely honest I believe the success of the surgery lies in the capability of the surgeon.

The vet that did Rex was head of small animal surgery at Texas A&M vet school for 32 years, as well as being a greyhound breeder. You'd think he'd be somewhat skilled. Maybe it also depends on the dog.... Edited September 19, 2013 by Hubcitypam

[cleptogrey]

hulling is not that difficult. one just needs to feel secure about picking and it's helpful to have someone pet the dog which you pick. make sure there is a clearly defined line around the corn. from street walks the blacktop often sands the surface down. i used to use a "sharp"- the needle used for IVs. but there is a good video on youtube where someone uses a human nail clipper- the fancy 2 handle kind w/ a petite point- i think it might be for cuticles. go search ...i think i may have posted the link on another gt blog. tons on corns- have fun!

[tbhounds]

The vet that did Rex was head of small animal surgery at Texas A&M vet school for 32 years, as well as being a greyhound breeder. You'd think he'd be somewhat skilled. Maybe it also depends on the dog....

I'm sure it does-depends on how well the dog heals, splints/wrap protocol etc....

[Guest MnMDogs]

My Rex had corns surgically removed from all four paws. I would NEVER do that to a dog again. The healing is painful and they just come right back. I had good luck with duct tape and a lot have had great success with hulling.

2 paws for Mork, and I can't agree more...don't do it. I keep them dremeled and he wears therapaws when we walk...which isn't very much lately, but he's worn them regularly for the better part of 9 years. I honestly don't see any benefit rimadyl could provide.

 

Also- Surgery was done by a greyhound savvy vet who worked with the track dogs in Raynam. Should have never done it

The vet that did Rex was head of small animal surgery at Texas A&M vet school for 32 years, as well as being a greyhound breeder. You'd think he'd be somewhat skilled. Maybe it also depends on the dog....

I've actually never heard of a surgery in which they didn't come back, have you? 6 months and morks were back.

Just going to throw this out here. I have had surgery performed to remove corns on one of mine (she has since past)-they never returned. We have also performed the same surgery in our clinic last year on another gh (GT member too) and just now (12 months later) one or two may have returned-this dog last year was absolutely cripple-he could not walk--he is now sound and for the entire last year he was able to be a happy pain free boy. To be completely honest I believe the success of the surgery lies in the capability of the surgeon.

This is the first success story I've heard. I still would manage with dremeling, hulling and therapaws. JMO

[KF_in_Georgia]

Silver is limping more than she ever has, and her corn is absolutely flat to the pad, with no definition. There's nothing that's clear enough to hull.

 

And she won't wear a boot. If you put just one on her, she hops and holds her booted corn foot out in front of her. Mom! I'm broken!

 

Put two boots on her and she still hops and holds her corn foot out in front of her, stopping frequently to try to get the boot off her good foot.

[Hubcitypam]

This is the first success story I've heard. I still would manage with dremeling, hulling and therapaws. JMO

Rex was 11 years ago and hulling was not really known at the time - it might still have been a gleam in someone's eye.. The duct tape worked very well, but you have to get a name brand like Nashua or Duck, not a bargain brand.

[christinepi]

KF_in_Georgia, same with Tracker, the corn is completely flat to the pad, no definition, although there is a clear color difference (light gray rather than black). If that flat kind of corn can't be hulled or dremeled, what can be done? Like in your case, Silver just has to live with it? Just out of curiosity: if there's (like in Tracker's case) a light gray color that makes the flat corn still well defined visually, would that make it hull-able?

[Guest MnMDogs]

Try soaking in Epsom salts. I soak a paper towel with them, it in Baggie, tape Baggie around foot, tv over with boot and leave for a2-3 hours. Generally they will will raise up a bit. Then you can try to pick it out.

[tbhounds]

All I can do is share my experience regarding surgery with corns. I'm sure the vet at Raytham and Texas A&M were very good experienced surgeons. Remember though, one does not need to be "gh savy" to perform surgery on a toe but, they need to be "gh savy" to recognize one In the first place.

To date I nave assisted in 4 gh corn surgeries and I would consider all 4 successful.

I'll let the GT member chime in if she chooses to relay her experience with her boys surgery.

[Batmom]

Our corn "surgery" was successful as well. Under anaesthesia the corn was hulled and then the hulled surface "just kissed" (my vet's words) with the surgical laser. The foot was slightly tender on prickly surfaces for a few days; dog wore a baby sock when out in the grass.

 

9 months later the dog developed two small corns on an adjacent toe. Those were hulled and never returned. The original corn never returned.

 

Flat corns can be hulled. If there's no separation from the rest of the pad tissue after some moisturizing, you may have something other than a corn.

 

I can't imagine not hulling a corn. It's like walking with a pebble in your shoe.

 

It is worth checking for corns or other pad injuries when any lameness presents.

[sweetdogs]

And secondly: should I strongly resist her suggestion to have the corn surgically removed, if it comes to that, or are there ever situations when surgery is justified? His doesn't even stick out or look bad, if that's anything to go by. It's just a little lighter in color than the rest of the pad and totally even it.

 

tbhounds is referring to my boy Conor in regard to surgery. In his case, he had corns on all 4 paws & was crippled. I had no choice. I tried everything for years & all it did was allow the corns to keep growing deeper. I tried duct tape, bee propolis, black salve, bag balm, Murray Avenue corn cream, drugs (rimadyl, tramadol & gabapentin), boots (he hated therapaws but tolerates Neo Paws) & hulling. NOTHING WORKED. The damn things took away his personality. Turning around on the couch was excruciating. And he was such a young happy boy before them. The front feet were done by a vet that surgically removed lots of corns while she was a busy adoption group's vet. That was 4 years ago & they haven't returned. The rear ones were done last year & sadly one has just popped back up. I had to convince the vet (a different one) to do the surgery last year but now she wants to get these out immediately (a new one has also formed on a different front pad).She went as deep as she had to (up to the flexor tendon) & got out all the abnormal tissue she could find He'll be having that done after Dewey. FWIW, his never stuck out very much

 

The surgery is painful, the recovery is long but I got my boy back once his pads healed & the the pad tissue regenerated.Surgery should not be a first choice because some of the non-invasive methods work for some dogs. I hope Tracker is one of them. But maybe your vet has had experience with corns & that why she suggested surgery. Best wishes for your boy - corns SUCK!!!!

[claudiav]

hull them yourself. here's the video someone posted not long ago. I have been doing it this way for years.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wdVWFUAT_4w

 

My Remy had surgery. It was a waste of money. It returned within 6 months. I kept paying $75/pop for vet to hull it every few weeks, until I learned how to hull myself. drugs won't do anything on that type of pain. Just got to remove the corn for him to feel better.

 

Good luck!

[Booker_Aye]

My Kimba suffers with a corn. We just keep hulling it, and use duct tape to help bring it up a bit. I haven't tried oral medications, because the real solution is to get the corn out, even if it must be done every month or so. I agree that corns are a real, real pain. In the past, someone suggested that hounds whose gait had been altered by injury might be particularly prone, and this would be true for Kimba, who had surgery for a tendon on her right rear leg, up near the hip, for her track career-ending injury. She is the only one of the five hounds I have had who has this particular curse, poor girl.