Rear Foot Inflammation - Fluid Draining, Ongoing Battle!

[Guest jetska]

OK, so I'm totally new to this forum and I'm joining to kind of vent. About 3 months ago I noticed that Barbie had some swelling on her rear foot, just above her paw pad. This burst and some clear serum and blood drained. I took her to the Vet. She went on a week long course of antibiotics.

 

The drainage hole sealed and it swelled up and burst again. More antibiotics, another week. I think she got some Metacam as well.

 

It went down again, then sealed, burst again. This time the vets admitted her for surgery, opened up the foot and cleaned it out. They said they couldnt find any tracks and so they thought if there was a foreign body that it wasn't still in there

 

She licked her foot a bit after the surgery and opened up another hole near the surgical site - a bit of clear fluid out of this again.

 

There has never really been any puss, just clear fluid and blood.

 

When the vet took the stitches out Barbie went to kick her in the head, she slipped and nicked her paw pad. This is the only time that she was lame on the foot because the paw pad obviously hurt.

 

The paw pad healed and the hole that Barbie made also healed, and guess what! It filled and burst again. Then it healed over and her whole leg swelled up over about 48hrs up to her 'knee' joint looked puffy. She was lame on her foot then. I took her back to the vet they gave an anti inflamatory shot and the skin opened up on the bottom of her foot once again... the swelling went down. They did xrays the next day, these came up normal. Sent home with a week's worth of metacam and 3 weeks worth of baytril. There's still a bit of fluid and it seems to be building up slowly. It really only takes a very small amount of fluid for me to notice it as their legs are just bones, skin and tendon!

 

I think as soon as the Metacam finishes it will puff up again so will be taking her back for a recheck. The vet said the next step would be an MRI as they don't want to open it up again in the hope of finding something they didn't find the first time. Vet also mentioned the possibility of some kind of soft tissue cancer. The MRI would obviously pick up either.

 

Barbie's almost 6, never raced and never had issues with her feet or being lame. She's insured so the MRI will be covered under pet insurance.

 

A friend suggested I go to a different Vet for another opinion but I think proceeding with the MRI might bring about a faster resolution to the issue giving a clear image of what is going on.

 

What do you guys think? Any similar experiences on here? This has been going on for about 3 months now and it's getting a bit grating for Barbie.

 

 

[tbhounds]

Does sound like she has a foreign body. Your vet would never be able to find a sliver of glass or the likes. That's like trying to find a needle in a haystack. If it was me I would just right into more imaging-CT Scan or MRI at this point. You're just running your wheels at this point.

[charbess]

Do what "tbhounds" says to do...they be smart!

[Guest jetska]

Yeh I'm thinking there is something in there and maybe her foot swelled up in a more extreme manner recently because it moved? I think initially the vets thought that her licking it was causing the problem to recur but she really only licks it after it sealed and swelled up a bit.

[MaryJane]

Any chance it could be a spider bite ? They can cause swelling at the puncture site with opening up and draining - there are some pictures on the site but, I can't remember which threads.

 

I did a quick look at the web and can't find anything but, as I mentioned, they had some great pictures on this site.

Edited August 17, 2013 by MaryJane

[Guest jetska]

There's always the possibility of a spider bite, but it has not been anywhere near as acute as the other spider bite threads and it def doesn't look like that. I'm in Australia so we don't have the same spiders either.

 

It's really been something that has been going on for 3 months but has only recently effected her enough to make her lame.

[PatricksMom]

Snake bite? Hoping you figure out what's going on and Barbie starts feeling better.

[tbhounds]

This has been going on for 3 months---rules out a spider or snake bite.

[Guest MnMDogs]

Do you have things like fox tails? I've seen some awful stories (and dogs affected) about foxtailsmworking their way into dogs' feet (and other areas of the body) and just migrating around

 

http://thebark.com/content/protecting-your-dog-against-foxtails

[Guest jetska]

We have lots of prickly type things, though not foxtails specifically - just did a google search and they look nasty.

[Guest Adrianne]

Hello Jetska.

 

Welcome to the world I've been living in for the last almost four months. I could have written parts of your post---the healing, only to swell again and burst open. In fact, just today, the last spot at the hock on Chevy's leg healed, and tonight his upper leg is swelled like a squishy water balloon. It's maddening, it's frustrating, and it makes you want to pull out your hair. It's constant wrapping and muzzling and trying to keep him off the leg.

 

In Chevy's case, he does have a foreign body in his leg--a plate and seven screws, which leads one to believe something has come loose. However, five different vets, three of them orthopedic vets, have looked at his original x-rays from when the hardware was placed and current x-rays, and all of them say nothing has moved or shifted. I did change vets over this issue, and I love my new vet. Not to say that he's right in his assessment, but he believes Chevy's problem is damage to his lymphatic system--hence the constant draining. He believes trauma to the leg has caused scar tissue to form channels in Chevy's leg into which the fluid drains. The lymph node behind his knee is not functioning properly and doesn't do what it's supposed to do. Basically, it's lymphedema--according to my vet. That lymph node is swollen but not painful to Chevy. If you Google 'popliteal lymph node' you can find the exact location and check Barbie or have your vet check to see if it's swollen. In Chevy, it's obvious. Anyway, the swelling causes pressure which is uncomfortable. Chevy licks the pressure points and opens up the wounds. As long as there's an open wound, there is no swelling, but then Chevy is licking because there is an open wound. It's a vicious cycle.

 

Like Barbie, what's draining out of Chevy's leg is mostly clear. We did have a bout of infection, but it responded well to antibiotics. We've tried two or three different antibiotics now, but no real success.

 

My vet says removing Chevy's hardware is not going to stop the drainage and swelling; I don't know if I believe that, and there's really only one way to find out. Chevy has a vet appointment on Tuesday, and I'm going to discuss surgical options. Management isn't working, and Chevy is miserable having to stay muzzled so much.

 

I'm so sorry you and Barbie are going through this. You have my utmost sympathy, and I am right there with you.

 

ETA: Your experience actually gives credence to what my vet has been telling me. He says it's natural to automatically assume with Chevy that the problem is with the plate and screws. But he's been fairly adament that that is not the problem. Sounds like you're having the same problem, and there is no hardware involved in your case.

Edited August 18, 2013 by Adrianne

[Batmom]

If they didn't culture when they did the surgery, that needs to be done. Have to get a needle and get way down in there, probably from a couple of different spots. Can't just take a swipe of whatever fluid is draining on the surface. Even people doctors are bad about that.

 

These things where fluid builds up, then opens and drains, builds up again, then opens and drains, are classic for plain old infection. Can't treat it effectively without knowing what it is. Won't know what it is without a culture.

 

In this case, could be a foreign body, too, and you'll want to explore that with better imaging than an x-ray.

[tbhounds]

I was going to suggest a culture but, the op mentioned they could not find a draining tract--he's also already on 3 weeks baytril.

[charbess]

What about inserting a drain and keeping that open and clear? We had to do that when Charlotte was attacked and they stitched her up but left the drain in for about 5 days. But, maybe not a good solution for you if he keeps fussing with it. Probably needs more extensive "excavation," at least to get a sample of what is coming out.

[Guest grey_dreams]

Do you have things like fox tails? I've seen some awful stories (and dogs affected) about foxtailsmworking their way into dogs' feet (and other areas of the body) and just migrating around

 

http://thebark.com/content/protecting-your-dog-against-foxtails

 

Just wanted to thank you for posting this. I've never heard of foxtail grass and never knew what a problem it could be. After reading several sites about it, now I am much better informed! Thank you!

[Guest MnMDogs]

Just wanted to thank you for posting this. I've never heard of foxtail grass and never knew what a problem it could be. After reading several sites about it, now I am much better informed! Thank you!

You are welcome... I never realized how bad it was until moving to California, and now it's all I hear about all summer. I met a lab at the vet last year that had multiple surgeries trying to remove a fox that that got in somewhere around his neck and migrated down his body for months and months. They hadn't been able to remove it in any of them.

Edited August 18, 2013 by MnMDogs

[OwnedBySummer]

Poor Barbie! I hope you find out what it is.

 

Foxtails sound horrible! Utterly horrible! Thanks for the link. Here's something which was in the comments. Wouldn't help the feet and legs much, though.

http://www.outfoxfieldguard.com/

Edited August 18, 2013 by OwnedBySummer

[Guest Rhea]

However, five different vets, three of them orthopedic vets, have looked at his original x-rays from when the hardware was placed and current x-rays, and all of them say nothing has moved or shifted. I did change vets over this issue, and I love my new vet. Not to say that he's right in his assessment, but he believes Chevy's problem is damage to his lymphatic system--hence the constant draining. He believes trauma to the leg has caused scar tissue to form channels in Chevy's leg into which the fluid drains. The lymph node behind his knee is not functioning properly and doesn't do what it's supposed to do. Basically, it's lymphedema--according to my vet. That lymph node is swollen but not painful to Chevy. If you Google 'popliteal lymph node' you can find the exact location and check Barbie or have your vet check to see if it's swollen. In Chevy, it's obvious. Anyway, the swelling causes pressure which is uncomfortable. Chevy licks the pressure points and opens up the wounds. As long as there's an open wound, there is no swelling, but then Chevy is licking because there is an open wound. It's a vicious cycle.

 

Like Barbie, what's draining out of Chevy's leg is mostly clear. We did have a bout of infection, but it responded well to antibiotics. We've tried two or three different antibiotics now, but no real success.

 

 

My gut instinct was to mention the lymph system too. Clear liquid drainage is either plasma or lymph fluids, most likely to be lymph fluids in this case. I don't know much about where lymph nodes are in dogs or anything like that, but it sounds like that's the most likely cause. (Lymphedema literally just means 'swollen lymph/swelling of the lymph'. Edema is any type of swelling that occurs from liquid build up in the body.)

[Guest jetska]

I had a feel around for her 'popliteal lymph node' and couldn't detect any swelling there. She doesn't mess with her foot if it is open and draining but when it seals up she does help it open again. I'm going to have to take her back to the vet probably tomorrow night after work so I will ask about that.

 

I have decided that we'll do the MRI - I think it's going to be the quickest way to a resolution if there is any abnormality with the lymphatic system they should be able to see it on the MRI as well. Do you think they will do imaging of both legs for comparison?

Since she has been on-leash only for like 3 months since this started, we have tried to make up for it taking her out and about. Here she is getting some snacks at a cafe

 

[Guest Adrianne]

I had a feel around for her 'popliteal lymph node' and couldn't detect any swelling there. She doesn't mess with her foot if it is open and draining but when it seals up she does help it open again.

 

Chevy, too, is much happier when there is an open draining spot on his leg. The pressure of the swelling seems to bother him much more than an open wound. And he helps open it up too.

 

Good luck, and please keep us updated. I'll be very interested to hear what you find.

[Guest luvmyborzoi]

I'm new too, but was looking for Borzoi a forum and saw your post. My Beauty is a sighthound but not a grey. However, the situation you describe is almost identical to what my girl went through from 8/2012 through 3/2013. Started as very small spot on rear toe. Within a day or two it was all swollen up, the outside right rear toe, then the pad. Had just boarded her three weeks before and she is an inside 7-1/2 y/o. Took her to that vet,8/2012 he didn't know what was wrong but suspected small cut or object causing infection, gave her simplicef and it cleared up only to come back in Nov 2012. Took her to my reg vet and he gave antiobiotic, it cleared up (no draining at this point) and then Jan 5, 2013 it came back. He had me soaking the foot in hexacloradine/distilled water solution twice daily and giving a different antibiotic. I noticed she'd started licking the other foot and next thing it was all swollen up (left rear), very tender, swollen and angry looking. He changed her meds, and a day or two later I told him it wasn't working. He sent me to a dermatology vet who wanted to put her to sleep and do a biopsy. Borzoi's are extremely sensitive to anesthesia and I said I had no comfort level with that, she suggested at least do cultures on both feet. I was okay with that, the report came back after the cultures grew, a few days or more, seemed like a long time. She had MRSA (hers was MRS?, a variation of the horrible staph infection MRSA. Don't know where/how she got it, but she transferred it to the left foot by licking it. Derm vet put her on chloramphenicol, huge tablets, three times a day for five or six weeks. (my dog 90#) It worked, I googled the medication, MRSA etc and it's August 19 and her feet are beautiful again. I haven't boarded her anywhere as I don't know where she got it. I google everything that goes on with my dog, actually, that's how I found this website. The derm's prescribing of this med is what the "experts" on the web recommended. The infection was so deep, this rx was strong enough to wipe it out. It was so painful and it drove me nuts continually coming back not to mention the COST!. I don't know if this will help you, but I would check it out with my vet. Our pups deserve a better life than living with experimentation or trial and error. My dog has new problems and I'm searching for a vet in Birmingham who has actually treated Borzoi's more than once. God bless with your pup, I sure hope this helps.

[Guest jetska]

Well the Vet is going to sort out a referral for an MRI tomorrow and get some indications for me about how much it will cost. They are convinced that it will give them more definitive answers. I have two Vets at the practice on to it. Will update this thread as we find out more.

[Guest jetska]

So I have a referral to a specialist clinic, just need to make the appointment. They suspect it might be an atypical infection but I don't want them to cut her open again! garh! in good news my foster dog will be off to her forever home soon, so I will try to tee the specialist up for next week

[kudzu]

Better sooner rather than later for that appt. Hope the specialist can get it sorted out. Sounds like y'all have been through enough already.

[Guest BlueCrab]

Luvmyborzoi mentioned MRSA-related infection with her dog. This sounds to me like some of the classic symptoms of a MRSA-related infection. While I'd stick with the MRI, I wouldn't rule out looking at MRSA or something similar. Would explain a lot....