No Judgments... Question About Off-Leash Hiking

[GreytHoundPoet]

There are a lot of people who hike and open field course with off leash sighthounds. People tend to forget that the breeds were developed as independent coursers and hunters who had to return to their owners. In the Medieval and Renaissance ages fewterers would control their hounds coming back by controlling the food and water resources. Today, we can do that but we also have GPS collars with handheld devices, squawkers, whistles, training collars, etc.

 

I do not hike with my hounds off leash (they are only off leash in unfenced areas at lure coursing trials) but I know a lot of people who do. Their observations make sense. Dogs who are used to being off leash tend to be less likely to bolt in "OMG! I'm free and can chase things and run, run, run!" excitement. We had an informal poll recently at a lure trial. The dogs who were the hardest to catch and get back were ones who are always on leash or in small yards. The ones who were easy to catch and had good recall were the ones who were used to large areas to run and roam (even fenced). It just loses that excitement and becomes the norm. A lot of people say that running them in a pack helps keep them together and close by, especially if a few of them have really great recall. Are there exceptions? Yes! But you know that already. If you are on Facebook you can join some of the groups that have open field coursing people. They can help you tremendously with off leash work.

 

Of course, the key is recall, recall, recall, knowing your dog, always being alert (the 1st time and the 30th time), going to safe places, and being prepared for anything. A friend off leash hikes with a pack of dogs, including an Ibizan Hound (one of my boys' littermates). She has come across deer, rabbits, boar, etc. on her hikes. He is a lure coursing fiend and a great hunter and yet she can still call him off prey and keep him close.

 

The moral of the story is: Greyhounds are dogs. Dogs can be trained. Just, be sure that you know your dog and make the best decision for him first and foremost, and for yourself. Also, make sure you aren't breaking a contract and causing issues for yourself. I know first hand that the Greyhound community can be great but it can also cause you a lot of strife, especially when posting on forums.

[cleptogrey]

every dog has a different temperment

every owner has a different temperment

 

carefully access the environment that you are letting him loose in

you know your dog well, go with your gut. be it sighthound, terrier, or what ever they can get in trouble, but so can we, our kids etc.

be sensible and did you really think you were going to get a response w/o judgement???? huh???

[silverfish]

There are a lot of people who hike and open field course with off leash sighthounds. People tend to forget that the breeds were developed as independent coursers and hunters who had to return to their owners. In the Medieval and Renaissance ages fewterers would control their hounds coming back by controlling the food and water resources. Today, we can do that but we also have GPS collars with handheld devices, squawkers, whistles, training collars, etc.

 

I do not hike with my hounds off leash (they are only off leash in unfenced areas at lure coursing trials) but I know a lot of people who do. Their observations make sense. Dogs who are used to being off leash tend to be less likely to bolt in "OMG! I'm free and can chase things and run, run, run!" excitement. We had an informal poll recently at a lure trial. The dogs who were the hardest to catch and get back were ones who are always on leash or in small yards. The ones who were easy to catch and had good recall were the ones who were used to large areas to run and roam (even fenced). It just loses that excitement and becomes the norm. A lot of people say that running them in a pack helps keep them together and close by, especially if a few of them have really great recall. Are there exceptions? Yes! But you know that already. If you are on Facebook you can join some of the groups that have open field coursing people. They can help you tremendously with off leash work.

 

Of course, the key is recall, recall, recall, knowing your dog, always being alert (the 1st time and the 30th time), going to safe places, and being prepared for anything. A friend off leash hikes with a pack of dogs, including an Ibizan Hound (one of my boys' littermates). She has come across deer, rabbits, boar, etc. on her hikes. He is a lure coursing fiend and a great hunter and yet she can still call him off prey and keep him close.

 

The moral of the story is: Greyhounds are dogs. Dogs can be trained. Just, be sure that you know your dog and make the best decision for him first and foremost, and for yourself. Also, make sure you aren't breaking a contract and causing issues for yourself. I know first hand that the Greyhound community can be great but it can also cause you a lot of strife, especially when posting on forums.

 

All of the above, especially the last: Just be sure you know your dog.

 

The two we have at the moment are not off-leaders. Jeffie is half-blind and is likely to step off the proverbial cliff - or simply run into something - and Sid is vulnerable with being a tripod and having muscle issues. If he put his foot in a hole, he would severely injure himself.

 

Actually Sid, by temperament, would be a good off-leader, but there are so very few places where he'd be safe, sadly. I really, really miss having off-lead dogs, but these two are simply not suitable right now.

 

OH another training tool I used, I use to hide on Bella. The first time I did it was in a huge fenced dog park, I just hid on her when she wasn't looking...and when she noticed I was gone, she ran around looking for me. I think this helps because after that she would look to see where I was every couple of minutes, making sure I was still there.

 

Yes - I consider this to be a very important part of their training. It teaches them to be aware of where you are at all times, and to keep up and not fall behind. We do this with all our newly off lead dogs.

[JohnF]

every dog has a different temperment

every owner has a different temperment

Different country, different perception of Greyhounds off-leash here in the UK, but those that do let them off-leash still only do so in sensible areas and at times when they won't bother other dogs. I will only let Peggy off-leash in certain areas because of prey drive (11/10 if she sees a cat, 3/10 for a hedgehog and 2/10 if it's a Bunny, and she's small dog safe) and also because she can be quite cussed when it comes to recall. I have noticed that she is so much better at recall if you are walking with someone else that has another dog either on leash or good at recall; so I feel the OP dog should be pretty safe as long as the other one is leashed.

[a_daerr]

so I feel the OP dog should be pretty safe as long as the other one is leashed.

 

I was wondering if that made a difference. Thanks!

[Yamaha_gurl]

Another tip, dress for off leash: Reflective collar, with a battery powered light, and bright scarf around the neck...just in case they get lost, they can be found easier this way, imo.

 

[Sambuca]

Another thing to practice is calling the dog to you, giving it a treat or ear rub then releasing it to roam again. I've seen many dogs avoid their owners because they've learned that the only time the owner calls them over is to leave and they don't want to leave. If you practice recall and release the dogs are happier to come to you.

[Guest Clawsandpaws]

Another thing to practice is calling the dog to you, giving it a treat or ear rub then releasing it to roam again. I've seen many dogs avoid their owners because they've learned that the only time the owner calls them over is to leave and they don't want to leave. If you practice recall and release the dogs are happier to come to you.

Definitely!!! I see this all the time. LOL. Also, I practice recall using different voices (Yes I do this at the dog park sometimes, and yes I get crazy looks) I use a panicky voice, angry voice, strained voice, etc. That way, if I am nervous/upset, Dudley is already used to hearing me that way, not just the happy "DUDLEY COME, YOU BIG HANDSOME BOY <insert high pitch happy squeals here>" I dunno, is too weird a thing to do??

[Sambuca]

Also reward the dog for coming to you without being called. This way the dog will check in with you more often.

[GreytHoundPoet]

Another thing to practice is calling the dog to you, giving it a treat or ear rub then releasing it to roam again. I've seen many dogs avoid their owners because they've learned that the only time the owner calls them over is to leave and they don't want to leave. If you practice recall and release the dogs are happier to come to you.

 

 

Also reward the dog for coming to you without being called. This way the dog will check in with you more often.

Yes! I very much agree. In fact, these are good practices even if people do not plan to let their dogs off leash. Accidents happen.

I spent the 3 day Memorial Day weekend at a lure coursing trial in Georgia. It was on an 8,000 acre horse farm. In between runs I was walking on of my Ibizan hound boys, Finnegan, on an adjacent field. He has on a brand new collar. He was playing in a pond and jumped up at a bird. He hit the end of the leash and the collar broke (shoddy *&^% craftsmanship, despite being highly recommended!)! I don't know if he realized what happened but he started to trot out of the pond toward the field to continue hunting for field mice. I bent down and in my high pitched play voice called "FINNY FINNY FINNY FINNY FINNY", which I use during play time all the time. He ran to me happily, tail going a mile a minute. I was able to retrieve him and take him back to get a different collar. I call my dogs all the time, just to give them love. I also give them love when they come up to me. Sometimes I have treats. That practice saved the day when his collar broke. Later that weekend the lure broke mid field on my Greyhound. Same thing. I bent down and called her by her pet name and she trotted across the field to me. Before I called her she was looking for something else to chase. My hounds know that coming to me is very fun and it helps tremendously.

[RedHead]

There are risks to everything. If you feel your dog is sufficiently trained to come back, recall is good, low prey drive, etc. I don't feel it is that different from any other breed of dog. I know Teague would stay with me on hikes, but he will also take off after deer, coyotes, other dogs at full run, so I can't let him off (I would love to). Karma is always off leash on hikes, she has no interest in running up to people or dogs and listens very well.

 

If I had a dog that had too much of an interest in approaching other dogs, chasing, etc I wouldn't let them off. I don't know how many times I have run into people with friendly and fairly well behaved off-leash dogs, who as soon as they see us, come running over despite their owner's calling.

[Guest Waterdog66]

I don't have much to offer by way of experience simply because I have had Audrey for such a short time. Seems like you know your hound and your relationship (Built on Trust) and so are best to judge what the boundaries are of that relationship.

 

I can maybe offer a different perspective though:

 

In the past month I have very much enjoyed exploring the hiking trails where I live (I do a fair bit of trail running) and sharing this experience with Audrey was something I did not expect. Having her ON-LEASH from my way of thinking never detracted from the experience. She seems to have a very strong prey drive but when we are out on hikes she mostly ignores everything after the first couple of minutes of excitement. I will probably never get to the point where I feel comfortable with her hiking OFF-LEASH but to me, that is just a personal boundary between me and her.

 

We are taking a trip later this month to Estes Park Colorado and I am taking some extra time on the way out to stop at a few places in Utah for some short day hikes with her. (Zion, Canyonlands and possibly Canyon De Chelly) Of course we are going to have a blast in Estes Park as there is plenty to do and see there. (I just hope she can be somewhat social with the transient population of Canadian Geese)

[tamara3462]

I don't have much to offer by way of experience simply because I have had Audrey for such a short time. Seems like you know your hound and your relationship (Built on Trust) and so are best to judge what the boundaries are of that relationship.

 

I can maybe offer a different perspective though:

 

In the past month I have very much enjoyed exploring the hiking trails where I live (I do a fair bit of trail running) and sharing this experience with Audrey was something I did not expect. Having her ON-LEASH from my way of thinking never detracted from the experience. She seems to have a very strong prey drive but when we are out on hikes she mostly ignores everything after the first couple of minutes of excitement. I will probably never get to the point where I feel comfortable with her hiking OFF-LEASH but to me, that is just a personal boundary between me and her.

 

We are taking a trip later this month to Estes Park Colorado and I am taking some extra time on the way out to stop at a few places in Utah for some short day hikes with her. (Zion, Canyonlands and possibly Canyon De Chelly) Of course we are going to have a blast in Estes Park as there is plenty to do and see there. (I just hope she can be somewhat social with the transient population of Canadian Geese)

Maybe you already checked into this, but just in case; most national parks do not allow dogs on the hiking trails. I know Rocky Mountain National Park doesn't but haven't looked into Zion and Canyonlands. Just a heads up

[Busderpuddle]

No flames and no judgement........just a question.

When you adopted your dog, did you sign an agreement with the adoption agency stating that you would never let them off leash ? I know we had to read a book and a story about it before we were allowed to have Ruby and tell the agency what we read. I would be afraid they would never adopt to me again if I broke the rules. I am kind of a rule freak though......

I also know that Ruby will never ever be trustworthy enough to let off her leash. Learned that the hard way when she ran out the fence one day and we luckily found her over 9 miles away.

[3greytjoys]

I'm very much NOT a fan of off leash for most dogs, most owners, most places. There are some exceptions but not many.

 

If you must do it, please don't do it around other dogs who are leashed. It's rude and causes problems for other people. Again with few exceptions (like 1 in 1,000,000), your dog is never as well behaved as you think s/he is.

 

 

Agree with Batmom and PiagetsMom.

 

Preparation can be done for every situation. Except for the one situation where the dog doesn't recall. If you've participated in even one greyhound Amber Alert, you know that heart-in-your-throat feeling that doesn't leave until the dog is captured (if it is). For me, off-lead is just not worth the risk.

 

 

As an avid hiker, and a Greyhound search team leader who has seen far too many Greyhounds take off, never to be found. I whole-heartedly agree with Batmom and FiveRoooooers.

 

Too high risk for beloved Greyhound lives. Loose Greyhounds place other animals at risk, and humans who get caught between dogs, not to mention owner liability. No human knows what their dog will do in every situation.

 

In my experience, hiking with leashed Greyhounds is great fun, much more safe, and greatly lessens medical risks of a hound injury. Common injuries for loose dogs are broken leg, open wounds, lethal snake bite, tick borne diseases, tick paralysis, poison ivy/oak, and myriad of diseases and parasites dogs get given opportunities to snack on tasty wild animal excrement. I saw a loose dog slip on wet rocks while trying to cross a shallow point of a creek/river only to get swept away. Watch those cliffs -- Hounds are used to running on solid ground in front of them. Same with bodies of water on the far side of vertical banks. Greyhounds have no reason to think they can't walk on water. After a dog wanders off-trail in deep brush/overgrowth, up mountain sides, good to consider how human would access injured dog, and carry a large, (resistant) Greyhound in extreme pain (broken leg/snake bite/bloody side ripped open) a lengthy distance over challenging terrain. If dog took off ignoring owner, how far/difficult would it be for owner to return to the region to search by foot every day for weeks, months or longer, not to mention the stress level, worry and heartache.

 

Not worth the risks to us... Greyhounds can have a blast hiking by our sides on leash, or running and playing in fenced enclosures, and resting when they tire out. Since we have hounds at different activity levels, we plan different outings for each.

 

Newbies: I would never fully "trust" a Greyhound. Greytalk's Greyhound Amber Alert lists many, many senior Greyhounds (9, 10, 11, 12+ years old) who were deeply bonded and loved by their family for many years when they took off. Many of those hounds were victims of "trust".

BTW, if crossing leashes is a problem there are easy remedies for that.

[BatterseaBrindl]

We're relatively 'new' to Greyhounds...Nixon came to us 'only' three years ago.

However, we've owned a variety of other dogs over the past 30 years and have never been in the practice of letting them go off-leash. And we live in the boonies on 80 acres of farmland.

 

Several of these dogs had excellent never-fail recalls...one was an excellent agility dog.

But I would never ever let them go off-leash in an open area.

To me it is not worth the risk. It only takes a split second for them to be gone.

 

I walk for an hour almost every day with Nixon, Ruby and Nigel.

This is not a casual stroll. I walk as fast as I can without running, with the 3 hounds clipped onto my walking harness.

We go on varied terrain...roads, fields and wooded trails.

Having them attached to me is not a problem at all. They don't get tangled up in trees or bushes or their leashes. We just hike along.

 

We sometimes go to a fenced in ball diamond or school yard because I 'think' they need a better run than our fenced yard allows.

However, all they do is run really, really fast across the field, then spend the next 20 minutes wandering and sniffing and peeing

Which they can do perfectly fine on our daily walks!

[krissy]

No flames and no judgement........just a question.

When you adopted your dog, did you sign an agreement with the adoption agency stating that you would never let them off leash ? I know we had to read a book and a story about it before we were allowed to have Ruby and tell the agency what we read. I would be afraid they would never adopt to me again if I broke the rules. I am kind of a rule freak though......

I also know that Ruby will never ever be trustworthy enough to let off her leash. Learned that the hard way when she ran out the fence one day and we luckily found her over 9 miles away.

 

While it often sucks to think of our beloved pets as "property", in the eye of the law that is exactly what they are. When you "adopt" your dog, you are basically buying a piece of property. And once yours, your property is yours to do with as you see fit. In other words, I imagine that once you adopt your dog that is really no way that "off leash clause" in the contract is at all enforceable. If they discovered you were off leashing your hound they couldn't do much about it. You're right that they could choose not to adopt to you again. But there are other groups and not all of them have such strict rules.

 

Honestly, I think the off leash clause from an adoption group is sort of extreme. Kind of like the blanket rules some groups have of requiring a fence or no young children. Taking that off leash clause very literally it stands to reason that greyhounds adopted from such a group could never do agility or lure coursing, or competitive obedience. None of those sports take place in a securely fenced location. The fences that make up a lot of agility rings are shorter than the jump height the dog would be competing at. Summit's competition jump heigh in agility is 26" (I plan to compete him as a veteran so he will only jump at 22"... but that's still as tall as a lot of ring fencing). Same with outdoor obedience competitions. Kili's next conformation show takes place outside. She'll be on a lead... if you consider a show lead to be "on lead"... which I don't. According to the adoption contract I signed for Summit, he shouldn't be in an agility ring. Now, that group burned their bridge with me very shortly after I adopted Summit and I long ago decided I would never adopt from them again, hence one of the reasons I ended up getting Kili from a breeder.

 

To that end, if being off leash is something that most greyhounds really can't do as most adoption groups suggest and most people on this forum would probably suggest... it is interesting then that breeders of greyhounds do not have the same mindset. I doubt they love the breed or their dogs any less than adoption folks.

 

Yes, your dog can get injured while hiking off leash. But it depends. Summit never leaves the trail. Pretty hard for him to get hurt. Kili is all over the place and the things she does and runs into... absolutely amazing. No broken skin yet. Ticks depending on where you live may or may not be an issue. Same with snakes. In Ontario there are just a few hot spots for ticks. I now live in one of them so Kili gets tick protection since she's into the long grass all the time. There is only one area in Ontario that has a venomous snake. When we go camping/hiking up there I do elect to put a long line on to have greater control. But where we live snakes are not an issue. I guess my point is you have to weigh the true and perceived risks against the true and perceived benefits. I think most people would agree that keeping your child in a bubble is not necessarily the best thing for the child. I kind of feel the same way about my dogs. Of course there are risks of injuries when letting them run off leash. You minimize those risks to what you are willing to accept. I am not willing to accept a hit by car. So I don't off leash near roads. I AM willing to risk my dogs falling or running into something. You can live your life with all the "what ifs" and "what could bes" or you can do what your dogs do and live in the moment. I would be upset if something happened to one of my dogs, of course. But I imagine if I didn't go hiking myself in the Bruce Peninsula because they have venomous snakes and I was afraid of getting bitten. I would never get to enjoy that beautiful area. I wouldn't get to share that with the people I love or my dogs, whom I love. If I didn't go I'd never know what I was missing so I wouldn't be unhappy. But I try to find ways to put as much joy into my life as possible, so I try to find ways to put as much joy into the lives of my dogs too. I accept the risks that go with that.

 

At the end of the day... if you talk the talk you have to be able to walk the walk... so just pick whatever walk you are comfortable with. All there is to it.

[Guest Clawsandpaws]

 

While it often sucks to think of our beloved pets as "property", in the eye of the law that is exactly what they are. When you "adopt" your dog, you are basically buying a piece of property. And once yours, your property is yours to do with as you see fit. In other words, I imagine that once you adopt your dog that is really no way that "off leash clause" in the contract is at all enforceable. If they discovered you were off leashing your hound they couldn't do much about it. You're right that they could choose not to adopt to you again. But there are other groups and not all of them have such strict rules.

 

Not that I am necessarily for or against off leash dogs:

 

At least for a lot of groups in the USA, when you sign the agreement, they can in fact do something about it, as many groups still retain partial ownership. Because the pets are indeed "property" I have read a lot of adoption clauses that retain partial ownership of the dog. I have also known a few groups that have gone out and reclaimed a dog for failure to abide the contract. Never specifically for an leash clause, but for other things that violated the contract.

 

 

 

This is the legal portion of my adoption agreement. "THE LEGAL PARTS:

10. --- retains a partial ownership lien on the greyhound whose tattoo numbers are shown on

this application. If at any time this dog is judged by FoG board members or by Animal

Control personnel or other legal authorities to be abused in any way, this adoption is null

and void. FoG may assume custody of the greyhound and all ownership rights will pass to

Friends of Greyhounds. Adopter will forfeit any and all adoption rights.

11. The adoption fee is non-refundable. --- accepts checks and credit cards. Dishonored

checks or credit cards will nullify this adoption agreement.

12. Failure to abide by this agreement may result in civil and/or criminal proceedings against

the adopter. Should legal action become necessary, the adopter agrees to be liable for

attorney’s fees should --- prevail.

The adopter(s) signature(s)on the last page indicates agreement to all 12 (twelve) of these clauses."

For the record, I have never seen a USA greyhound adoption contract that didn't have a leash clause. Greyhound grps are also so communicative, that you could essentially be blacklisted by many grps on heresay. I don't feel that's right, as quite frankly, I have never heard of a lost grey/injured grey that was due to being off leash. I think many groups have this clause to protect the not 100% commonsense owners. Many people adopt a grey and never research/train etc. There is nothing wrong with that, but instilling these fears into an adopted at the beginning may protect that hound in the future if the person staunchly believe they can never let the dog off leash.

[krissy]

 

Not that I am necessarily for or against off leash dogs:

 

At least for a lot of groups in the USA, when you sign the agreement, they can in fact do something about it, as many groups still retain partial ownership. Because the pets are indeed "property" I have read a lot of adoption clauses that retain partial ownership of the dog. I have also known a few groups that have gone out and reclaimed a dog for failure to abide the contract. Never specifically for an leash clause, but for other things that violated the contract.

 

 

 

This is the legal portion of my adoption agreement. "THE LEGAL PARTS:

10. --- retains a partial ownership lien on the greyhound whose tattoo numbers are shown on

this application. If at any time this dog is judged by FoG board members or by Animal

Control personnel or other legal authorities to be abused in any way, this adoption is null

and void. FoG may assume custody of the greyhound and all ownership rights will pass to

Friends of Greyhounds. Adopter will forfeit any and all adoption rights.

11. The adoption fee is non-refundable. --- accepts checks and credit cards. Dishonored

checks or credit cards will nullify this adoption agreement.

12. Failure to abide by this agreement may result in civil and/or criminal proceedings against

the adopter. Should legal action become necessary, the adopter agrees to be liable for

attorney’s fees should --- prevail.

The adopter(s) signature(s)on the last page indicates agreement to all 12 (twelve) of these clauses."

For the record, I have never seen a USA greyhound adoption contract that didn't have a leash clause. Greyhound grps are also so communicative, that you could essentially be blacklisted by many grps on heresay. I don't feel that's right, as quite frankly, I have never heard of a lost grey/injured grey that was due to being off leash. I think many groups have this clause to protect the not 100% commonsense owners. Many people adopt a grey and never research/train etc. There is nothing wrong with that, but instilling these fears into an adopted at the beginning may protect that hound in the future if the person staunchly believe they can never let the dog off leash.

 

 

Ah, well, if they retain partial ownership then that is of course I different issue. I didn't realize groups did that since none of the ones I'm familiar with around here do. I'm not sure how I feel about that. I'm not sure I think that's right for an adoption group. I've heard of it from breeders if they want to show a dog or have some breeding rights. If my breeder had wanted to retain part ownership of Kili I probably would not have gotten her. As far as I'm concerned I should own my dog outright and I should be able to choose for him/her what to do. I mean, the group retaining partial ownership opens a whole can of worms doesn't it? If someone else owns part of my dog then why should they not pay part of the vet bills associated with said dog? That may be somewhere in the legal notes that they will not, but otherwise doesn't that leave them wide open to someone trying to get them to pay for a surgery they can't afford... say a leg amputation?

 

As far as blacklisting someone... sure maybe from some groups. It might make your life difficult but it's not like you can't get a greyhound. Of my own free will I eliminated one group in my area which made my life a heck of a lot harder in searching for dog number 2. I actually had an acquaintance in Georgia looking for a dog for me down there. Then I got the idea that a pup might be a good idea for a blank slate. Not many breeders, not many puppies, but they're there if you know where to look.

 

It would definitely suck if a bunch of adoption groups wouldn't adopt to you. But again, if that bothers you enough that you won't off leash your hounds it's probably not the blacklisting that is holding you back. It's probably that you're not comfortable with it or not sure how you feel about it. And that's the more important factor... how you as a person feel. I think for those of us who are really for off leashing our hounds, we simply wouldn't adopt from those groups and/or wouldn't care if we got blacklisted because we could get our hound elsewhere.

Edited June 7, 2013 by krissy

[Guest Greyt_dog_lover]

To that end, if being off leash is something that most greyhounds really can't do as most adoption groups suggest and most people on this forum would probably suggest... it is interesting then that breeders of greyhounds do not have the same mindset. I doubt they love the breed or their dogs any less than adoption folks.

 

 

I don't know of any racing greyhound farms that are in anything other than a rural setting. Most greyhound groups are generally in larger populated areas, hence the difference...

[Yamaha_gurl]

 

Ah, well, if they retain partial ownership then that is of course I different issue. I didn't realize groups did that since none of the ones I'm familiar with around here do. I'm not sure how I feel about that. I'm not sure I think that's right for an adoption group. I've heard of it from breeders if they want to show a dog or have some breeding rights. If my breeder had wanted to retain part ownership of Kili I probably would not have gotten her. As far as I'm concerned I should own my dog outright and I should be able to choose for him/her what to do. I mean, the group retaining partial ownership opens a whole can of worms doesn't it? If someone else owns part of my dog then why should they not pay part of the vet bills associated with said dog? That may be somewhere in the legal notes that they will not, but otherwise doesn't that leave them wide open to someone trying to get them to pay for a surgery they can't afford... say a leg amputation?

 

As far as blacklisting someone... sure maybe from some groups. It might make your life difficult but it's not like you can't get a greyhound. Of my own free will I eliminated one group in my area which made my life a heck of a lot harder in searching for dog number 2. I actually had an acquaintance in Georgia looking for a dog for me down there. Then I got the idea that a pup might be a good idea for a blank slate. Not many breeders, not many puppies, but they're there if you know where to look.

 

It would definitely suck if a bunch of adoption groups wouldn't adopt to you. But again, if that bothers you enough that you won't off leash your hounds it's probably not the blacklisting that is holding you back. It's probably that you're not comfortable with it or not sure how you feel about it. And that's the more important factor... how you as a person feel. I think for those of us who are really for off leashing our hounds, we simply wouldn't adopt from those groups and/or wouldn't care if we got blacklisted because we could get our hound elsewhere.

 

I am on the "Do not Adopt" list, because I choose to let Bella off leash. However, I'm not too worried...Bella's racing owner has told me when the day comes that I want another, just to drive on down and adopt one, she lets her brood momma's off leash, un-enclosed areas And I'm sure there are many racing owners on here, that as well have no issue with being off leash and would gladly adopt to me.

 

Oh and Krissy, you have the blue slip fyi, you are the legal owner.

 

One of the biggest factors when I decided to train recall MUCH harder with Bella and let her off leash, was when Whitewaves greyhound puppy passed away. I decided that day that life was too short. I know the risks, I also live life dangerously and have a heck of a fun time doing so. Bella is taught the same.

Edited June 7, 2013 by Yamaha_gurl

[Guest AngelPup]

 

Basically, you're going to get stories about "the one time" and trusting your hound too much but it's your life and you need to do what you are comfortable with and can live with.

 

 

 

This bugs me a bit. It's not your life that's at stake, it's your dog's life. I don't think I would ever feel comfortable letting my dog loose in an un-enclosed area. Everything I've ever read about greyhounds states they should never be let off leash--and the adoption agency stressed that to me as well--"under no circumstances, let him off lead on a walk."

 

Ultimately, it is your decision and you know him best. I'm not judging you, just the action.

 

My opinion is that we are the guardians of our dogs and it's our responsibility to do what is in their best interest. Not just what's easier for us.

[a_daerr]

The group that I adopted Henry from doesn't retain partial ownership. Here's how much their contract held up. Once, they adopted a grey to a couple when then tried to sell the dog on Craigslist. There was a clause in the contract that stated something to the effect of, "If the adopter can no longer care for the dog, they must return it to X Adoption Group immediately." So obviously, selling on the interest was a clear violation of the contract. They spoke to their attorney, who confirmed there was no real, legal recourse. So to get the dog back, they ended up doing a sting operation, where somone contacted the adopter over Craigslist, posing to be a potential buyer. Then when they met in person, they asked to walk the dog around the block and just never came back. Some "contract."

 

Strangely enough, Truman's breed did retain partial ownership (I believe it has something to do with breeding rights). I do find it very interesting, as Kristie said, that AKC/CKC breeders don't seem to have such strict clauses as the adoption groups do. On the day I adopted Truman, I came equipped with photos of my fence, a martingale collar, my copy of Greyhounds for Dummies, etc. The woman was like, "Oh... that's not really necessary, but alright."

 

I appreciate all the advice, even from those who don't think it's a good idea. The majority of greyhounds probably DON'T have the prey-drive or recall training to be off leash. But there are no absolutes in life. If you put the work in and you're willing to take the risk, I do think it ultimately comes down to whatever you're comfortable with.

[a_daerr]

Everything I've ever read about greyhounds states they should never be let off leash--and the adoption agency stressed that to me as well--"under no circumstances, let him off lead on a walk."

 

It's much easier to make a blanket statement to newbie adopters that "greyhounds must never be off leash" than to say, "If you've done substantial obedience training and recall, and your dog has the right temperament and prey-drive, then maybe you have a shot."

[Guest PiagetsMom]

AngelPup, on 07 Jun 2013 - 09:56 AM, said:

Everything I've ever read about greyhounds states they should never be let off leash--and the adoption agency stressed that to me as well--"under no circumstances, let him off lead on a walk."

 

 

 

 

It's much easier to make a blanket statement to newbie adopters that "greyhounds must never be off leash" than to say, "If you've done substantial obedience training and recall, and your dog has the right temperament and prey-drive, then maybe you have a shot."

 

But isn't it fortunate that adoption groups, with or without leash contracts, don't have the attitude/policy of "you play/you pay" in the event they're needed to help find a lost off-leash greyhound.