Belly Bands? Going Through Too Much Nature's Miracle :(

[Guest EvanstonGrey]

Hi all,

 

As you may know, we just adopted Fika's littermate Ferris last week - he came up by plane from Ft Lauderdale and has been with us in Evanston for 6 days. They get along well and we love him already, but he's been peeing in the condo about once a day. Never poops inside.

 

Fika went through a prison training program and a foster home before coming to us, so she was pretty much trained from the beginning. Before we got Ferris, we were on a much more streamlined daily schedule - she wakes 9am or later and can hold it forever if she wants to. I'm a research nerd so I have been doing tons of reading on this but I'm sad that it's become a problem for us.

 

Our new boy gets plenty of treats and praise for peeing outside, a loud "no" if he gets caught in the act and then it's outside immediately. The crate was not popular, so we have been using a belly band when we can't watch him and he's never urinated in the band - even going up to 5 hrs without peeing. I take up their water after dinner so he can make it through the night - was waking at 4am to go out - and I feel a little bad about that... but we're tired!

 

Here's how today went:

7:30am wake up, out to p&p

8am breakfast

8:30 am p&p

9am-12pm home alone with dry belly band

12pm long walk (1hr), p&p

12-4:30pm home in dry belly band

4:30pm-5:30pm dog park walk and run, p&p

5:30-6:30pm playtime, NO BELLY BAND, no accident

6:30pm dinner

6:45pm ACCIDENT - PEE IN HALLWAY

6:45pm out to p&p

7:15pm POST TO GT

 

Yesterday was pretty similar except he had his accident around 2pm when I was doing the laundry. I get that he's new and learning everything - we've got plenty of time to work it all out. Should I just keep putting him in the band when I can't watch him? I work from home but I do need to get some stuff done. Have you guys used belly bands in this way to help with house training? I don't want to teach him that he only has to hold it with the band...

 

Any thoughts? Words of wisdom? Encouragement and/or reassurance for this frustrated new mama of 2?

 

Here are some photos of the two knuckleheads!

 

 

OH - also, went to the vet yesterday - no UTI, clean bill of health...

[revamp]

Based on your time schedule (which, by the way, is excellent information to have and is great to keep track of) I think the issue is less wearing/not wearing the bellyband and more the timing.

 

Most dogs are hardwired to have to p&p after waking up, after eating, and sometimes after playing. Especially during housebreaking, care should be taken to walk the dog *immediately* after feedings. I think the "oops" here was not walking him right after he finished eating dinner.

 

PS--your dogs are gorgeous

Edited November 15, 2012 by revamp

[Houndtime]

Very handsome dogs. Is he peeing or marking? There is a difference.

[Guest EvanstonGrey]

Based on your time schedule (which, by the way, is excellent information to have and is great to keep track of) I think the issue is less wearing/not wearing the bellyband and more the timing.

 

Most dogs are hardwired to have to p&p after waking up, after eating, and sometimes after playing. Especially during housebreaking, care should be taken to walk the dog *immediately* after feedings. I think the "oops" here was not walking him right after he finished eating dinner.

 

PS--your dogs are gorgeous

 

Thanks so much! You're probably right - likely we need to make sure to do the walks right after breakfast and dinner - maybe it'll get me in better shape! Hopefully he'll calm down more soon too and we'll find our groove. I don't like pee cleanup but I can't imagine how crazy this has been for him...

 

Do you think I should ditch the bellyband? It gives me some peace of mind and was hoping to gradually use it less and less over the next few days.

 

Very handsome dogs. Is he peeing or marking? There is a difference.

 

Pretty sure it's peeing. It's large quantities and he will stop halfway if I catch him and finish up outside. How can I tell the difference? Oddly he seems less interested in marking outside than his sister, who squats every block or so

 

here's another one from today - i almost feel like i should dress up to walk them! they make me look bad in my sweats

 

[Guest mld]

Is he in his crate during the night and while you are out? While you are home you can try the umbilical cord method, this way you can catch it before he has an accident! Just a thought

[revamp]

 

Do you think I should ditch the bellyband? It gives me some peace of mind and was hoping to gradually use it less and less over the next few days.

 

 

I don't think wearing the bellyband during the times he's home unattended is necessarily a bad thing, but I would absolutely not have it on him at any time where you are at home. Your sole purpose in life should be watching him and anticipating his needs in terms of potty times. He shouldn't be out of your sight and the belly band might make you a little too comfortable and therefore not be watching as closely for his subtle signals of needing to go (pacing, laying down and getting back up, looking out a window or a door, looking at you, whining, etc...)

[Houndtime]

They are such a handsome pair.

[Guest EvanstonGrey]

They are such a handsome pair.

 

Thanks! I think so too, but I'm biased of course!

 

Do you think I should ditch the bellyband? It gives me some peace of mind and was hoping to gradually use it less and less over the next few days.

 

 

I don't think wearing the bellyband during the times he's home unattended is necessarily a bad thing, but I would absolutely not have it on him at any time where you are at home. Your sole purpose in life should be watching him and anticipating his needs in terms of potty times. He shouldn't be out of your sight and the belly band might make you a little too comfortable and therefore not be watching as closely for his subtle signals of needing to go (pacing, laying down and getting back up, looking out a window or a door, looking at you, whining, etc...)

 

Yes, this makes sense - kind of like the umbilical cord method mld mentioned? He always seems to pee in these split-second moments when I'm unloading the dishwasher or something like that. I am going to get some sleep/work done again at some point soon, right?

[Guest poofmagk]

Fika and Ferris are a beautiful pair!

 

In our case Oliver just seemed to take longer to learn the rules than Zafira did. At first even if we were in the same room watching him closely, Oliver would just go. So we kept working on establishing consistent potty times throughout the day, but decided to keep a belly band on whenever he was inside. He never went with the belly band on, so I think that helped to establish that inside was not a proper place to go. He caught on after a few weeks at which point we retired the belly band. Now, he is really good about waiting for the routine outings, or letting us know if he really needs to go. In general he seems to have less control or a smaller bladder than Zafira, she seems to be able to hold it indefinitely.

[GeorgeofNE]

You're housebreaking him. Just because he's an adult doesn't mean he "gets it" any better than a puppy!

 

I would suggest that you keep the dog with you when you're working at home. We all have to "get things done" but until such time as the dog is truly housebroken, one of those "things" is keeping your eye on him!

 

And most dogs DO have to go after they eat.

 

The 4 AM wake up is probably more related to being woken early at the kennels and not about bladder control. My dog used to do that too. This is when you teach, "Go lie down"!

 

I think you're mostly doing things right--but please don't get frustrated so soon. It sounds like he's really trying.

[cleptogrey]

Is he in his crate during the night and while you are out? While you are home you can try the umbilical cord method, this way you can catch it before he has an accident! Just a thought

exactly what i was thinking. might be a pain in the begining, both of you need to get used to it, but it's a good positive way to keep him on target. also always give him a treat- something special and yummie when he pees/poops outside. don't neglect his littermate when you are treating him. when the other dog goes- a treat as well.

[Guest EvanstonGrey]

Thanks for all the advice! He is trying so hard, I know it will just take time and he'll catch on. He really hates the crate, not sure if it's because he's in there and his sister isn't or what - this is why we've been trying the belly band.

 

My thinking is that we'll up the number of potty breaks, stick to a schedule, and I'll keep him next to me as much as I can - just using the band when I leave the house.

 

Really appreciate your input, I'm still a rookie and trying my best with these sweeties

[Guest SealDogMermaid]

Gosh your houndies are gorgeous! Thanks for the photos :-) Best of luck with the housebreaking!

Edited November 15, 2012 by SealDogMermaid

[Guest EvanstonGrey]

Gosh your houndies are gorgeous! Thanks for the photos :-) Best of luck with the housebreaking!

 

Thanks! No accidents today! SUCCESS!! Hopefully tomorrow will be the same

[Guest EvanstonGrey]

ARGGGHH!!!!!

Ferris was doing SO well, though all of a sudden it seems like we're backsliding out of nowhere!

One accident last week while I was out (thought it was a fluke) and another today - not sure if he meant to pee on the bed or if it splashed onto it or what, but that worries me a bit. He seems to always go in different places, which I guess means the Nature's Miracle is working if nothing else.

Back to housetraining 101? And maybe a vet visit?

This guy is giving me grey hairs...

[vjgrey]

Back to housetraining 101? And maybe a vet visit?

 

Yep - I'd do both.

[Guest EvanstonGrey]

Thanks... I sometimes worry I'm taking stuff too seriously, but it seems weird to me that he'd go back to doing this. Requested an appointment for next week, poor guy... I hope if he's sick we can get him sorted out, otherwise, we'll just be hanging out very close together for a while

[Batmom]

Vet check (urinalysis, bloodwork if he hasn't had any) sure can't hurt.

 

He might be one of those dogs who has to go out RIGHT after dinner. If that's not convenient, you could try taking him out right before you feed instead -- that might buy you more time AFTER you feed.

 

I would probably start taking him out just a bit more often until he's gone a month or two with no accidents for any reason. Then start scaling back the "outs" again and see how he does.

[Guest EvanstonGrey]

True! I had been taking them out for 6 walks a day, then 5, then 4 (2 one-hour exercise walks and 2 short ones) - which I thought was ok, but probably more is better - I'll bundle up and we'll head out more He goes 9 hours overnight with no trouble.

 

He had a UA and full blood panel in November when I adopted him (everything normal), but I'll bring him in again to make sure.

Incidentally, whenever he has an accident, I stop him mid-way through, take him out, and then he always pees a ton more, so it's definitely not marking and he really does try to hold it... I think it's gotta be that he needs more potty breaks or he's got some kind of infection...

[Guest june]

My girls have learned that they finish their food and walk to the door to be let out to potty. Do not pass Go. Do not collect $200.

[a_daerr]

Bellybands are great for markers. They were a life-saver for one of our fosters who had the habit of liftiing his leg on everything... However, IMHO, bellybands aren't very helpful for a dog that's not actually housetrained. Not to mention that when saturated, they are a breeding ground of bacteria and pose a potential risk for UTI. You would probably do better with a strict food-water-elimination schedule and a housebreaking method (either crating, confining, or constant supervision, like the umbilical method mentioned above). If he continues to have opportunities, he'll continue having accidents. For a week or so, you're going to have to let him out A LOT, especially after meals and naps. You first want him to understand the idea of where he's supposed to go, then you can cut back. Reward reward reward when he goes when he goes outside.

 

My favorite resource on housebreaking is "How to Housebreak Your Dog in 7 Days" by Shirlee Kalstone. It's a very quick and easy read, but also very comprehensive.