Gsod And Limping

[Guest Energy11]

I totally AGREE with everyone here, regarding getting a digital x-ray and/or mailing the films to Dr. Couto. He usually gets back to you the same day, when he is there. I emailed him about Goldie's probable brain lesion, and I am following HIS protocol. It seems to be helping her. The man is an ANGEL!

 

NJ to OSU really wouldn't be a bad trip, and than, you'd have THE BEST, for sure. All is up to you, of course.

 

AS tbhounds said, and I agree ... if it were I, I'd cancel the elective surgery right now. You have too much on your plate. Trust me, I know ... I have a very sick girl here, too.

 

No matter, I hope you can get pain control going soon, and that you can either, get x-rays to OSU, or go there.

 

Sending love, hugs and prayers!

 

 

[riverbosun]

Have to agree re: an MRI. I'd have a radiologist read them or repeat them. Overnight them to OSU or even a radiologist at Tufts. Next step would lead to a biopsy.

[RedFawnMom]

The vet gave her Metcam(?) or Metacam...I can't remember the exact name, it's mentioned here a lot. I gave her a dose late last night. She has been sleeping constantly since we brought her home - sedation was around 6:00 pm, I am getting worried because she seems so lethargic. When we brought her into the vet she was happy, bouncy...walking oddly but didn't seem to be in a lot of pain. Last night I tried to get her up and her back legs were trembling...she had peed in her bed while sleeping (she's done this once before when sick), I was trying to gently wipe off her legs and it seemed like maybe that was painful for her. So now I feel horrible, because she's in worse shape than before we took her to the vet. What could have caused an increase in pain? Could the exam/positioning during X-ray have caused it?

 

I am off to make some phone calls. Thank you for all of the support.

[kudzu]

So why the MRI so quickly? Is that part definite or just a suggestion from your vet? In my experience MRI is used more for soft tissue, tendon, ligament, nerves, etc. Just wondering if he had a strong reason for the MRI instead of new rads or CT. Glad you went for the xrays so quickly. Hope you've found someone to reread or reshoot them ASAP. A 24/7 oncoradiology vet would sure be handy right now. Sending that the spot was just an artifact. (Think that's the term.)

[Guest Energy11]

Metacam is a good NSAID, and works well. Tramadol is another possibilitiy.

 

It is hard to say why she seems in MORE pain than prior to seeing the vet. It could be the positioning for the x-rays. I'd surely call the vet about that.

 

If you don't feel the pain is being managed, I'd ask the vets to re-evaluate her pain management, as well.

 

Sending more good thoughts! Keep us posted. Hugs! Dee

[duncan41]

Can't add anything to what has been posted. Just know that I will keep you and your girl tucked tightly in my prayers.

[RobinM]

I am so sorry. As far as why she seems to be in more pain now, sometimes the vet has to twist them into a pretzle in order to get the pictures they need on x-ray.

 

Hope she is confortable. So sad.

 

 

[Magdalyn58]

Sending prayers and hugs to you and Lucy...

[Guest greytbookert]

Sending many, many prayers!

[kudzu]

She has been sleeping constantly since we brought her home - sedation was around 6:00 pm, I am getting worried because she seems so lethargic.

Have you seen her reaction to sedation before? Could this just be her normal reaction? Some dogs can take a long time to fully recover. Sleeping it off for a day or so is a possibility.

 

Last night I tried to get her up and her back legs were trembling...she had peed in her bed while sleeping

I had one who was always weak after sedation & sometimes really sluggish.

 

... she's in worse shape than before we took her to the vet. What could have caused an increase in pain? Could the exam/positioning during X-ray have caused it?

Perhaps. Why was she sedated? I think mild sedation for xrays is often used specifically because the positions needed will be uncomfortable. Though I've only seen it in my senior Grey who had back probs & a Lab with bad hips, a friend with Danes has had that issue & now insists are being in the room for rads. My hopeful self wants to think the rads are wrong & her GSOD came from an injury that is just more painful today.

Edited December 11, 2010 by kudzu

[RedFawnMom]

So why the MRI so quickly? Is that part definite or just a suggestion from your vet? In my experience MRI is used more for soft tissue, tendon, ligament, nerves, etc. Just wondering if he had a strong reason for the MRI instead of new rads or CT. Glad you went for the xrays so quickly. Hope you've found someone to reread or reshoot them ASAP. A 24/7 oncoradiology vet would sure be handy right now. Sending that the spot was just an artifact. (Think that's the term.)

 

MRI would rule out bone cyst. The MRI isn't definite, I guess. I think what he suggested was taking her up to Tuft's and seeing what they said - but I wanted to get an MRI locally then decide where to treat her...then thought about it and decided I didn't want to use the local MRI place - they have mixed reviews...and at Tuft's they could do a biopsy at the same time, if the MRI indicated a need for one.

 

I am waiting for our regular vet (who is a greyhound owner) to call me back. In the meantime I'm looking for a local radiologist.

 

ETA: She is still not herself, but got outside to pee and trotted a little, and ate 1/2 of her breakfast and got up to get some water, but returns to her bed. She's had general anesthesia twice and is usually "off" for a day and kind of sluggish. I'm relieved that she's perking up a bit but I do think the positioning of the X-rays caused her some pain and I don't want to put her through it again if we can avoid it. But of course will do what's best.

Edited December 11, 2010 by RedFawnMom

[NeylasMom]

First of all, I'm so sorry you're going through this. I have been dealing wtih Neyla's dx since May and it is not easy.

 

A couple of things :

 

First priority, get x-rays from someone who has high def digital equipment. I would actually suggest finding an orthopedist as they will almost certainly have it, and more importantly should be ale to get the x-rays with out sedating her. Since you already know where the spot is, that may help them identify where to x-ray and limit the number she needs. Once you have those, email them immediately to Dr. Couto's team.

 

If the general consensus is that it's osteo, which unfortunately does seem most likely (how old is Lucy btw?), then I would NOT do a biopsy. A fine needle aspirate (FNA) is much safer and less painful and should give you an answer. Doing a biopsy increases the risk of a hairline fracture during the procedure and would require anesthesia, while many vets will do an FNA w/o anesthesia.

 

In the meantime, you need to get her pain controlled. Metacam or another NSAID is a good start, but ask about adding Tramadol in if the nsaid doesn't seem sufficient. I do think it's very likely that the movement from the x-rays caused increased pain, and it should subside with a few days, but in the meantime, pain meds to control her pain. You can back off of them in a few days once she is feeling better.

 

I would also continue researching treatment options and try to decide what you will want to do if this is osteo. Time is of the essence with this disease, but it sounds like you have the added complication of deciding whether to proceed with your own surgery. If you are going to amputate, you will want to do it immediately, and since the recovery can be a bit rough I would think you would in that case want to postpone your surgery.

 

I know it's a lot to take in, try to get some clearer answers for now and go from there. If it does turn out to be oesto, which I truly hope is not the caswe then at least you will be prepared. There's a group o fus in the osteo thread that are available for support as well, and you may find good info if you read through it on treatment options. Bigorangedog also has a good blog on what to expect if you do amputate.

 

Hang in there.

[RedFawnMom]

She's only 4. Her pain seems much better now, actually - I wonder if the shaking last night was more from the sedation/being cold/just generally being nervous. She is starting to get up a bit more to get water, eat some of her breakfast and come see me for lovies. But I will ask the vet about other options for pain control as well.

 

A FSA into bone without anesthesia sounds very painful I was already leaning toward not having the biopsy, if it comes to that. I did not know that FSA was an option. I have not done much research. Hoping I won't need to.

 

Where does one find an orthopedist? My vet's office is not being very proactive about this - their plan is to take a picture of the film and "put it on the Internet" on some site where vets comment on that sort of thing. That does not sound like a good plan to me. So I am taking over. I googled and found a couple of clinics that say they have orthopedists...I guess I just pick one. Argh.

 

It could still just be a cyst, right?

[Guest Greytluv]

Lucy

 

Send the xray to Dr. Cucto.

Edited December 11, 2010 by Greytluv

[robinw]

As others have said, please send the xray to Dr. Couto.

[joejoesmom]

First of all, I'm so sorry you're going through this. I have been dealing wtih Neyla's dx since May and it is not easy.

 

A couple of things :

 

First priority, get x-rays from someone who has high def digital equipment. I would actually suggest finding an orthopedist as they will almost certainly have it, and more importantly should be ale to get the x-rays with out sedating her. Since you already know where the spot is, that may help them identify where to x-ray and limit the number she needs. Once you have those, email them immediately to Dr. Couto's team.

 

If the general consensus is that it's osteo, which unfortunately does seem most likely (how old is Lucy btw?), then I would NOT do a biopsy. A fine needle aspirate (FNA) is much safer and less painful and should give you an answer. Doing a biopsy increases the risk of a hairline fracture during the procedure and would require anesthesia, while many vets will do an FNA w/o anesthesia.

 

In the meantime, you need to get her pain controlled. Metacam or another NSAID is a good start, but ask about adding Tramadol in if the nsaid doesn't seem sufficient. I do think it's very likely that the movement from the x-rays caused increased pain, and it should subside with a few days, but in the meantime, pain meds to control her pain. You can back off of them in a few days once she is feeling better.

 

I would also continue researching treatment options and try to decide what you will want to do if this is osteo. Time is of the essence with this disease, but it sounds like you have the added complication of deciding whether to proceed with your own surgery. If you are going to amputate, you will want to do it immediately, and since the recovery can be a bit rough I would think you would in that case want to postpone your surgery.

 

I know it's a lot to take in, try to get some clearer answers for now and go from there. If it does turn out to be oesto, which I truly hope is not the caswe then at least you will be prepared. There's a group o fus in the osteo thread that are available for support as well, and you may find good info if you read through it on treatment options. Bigorangedog also has a good blog on what to expect if you do amputate.

 

Hang in there.

 

excellent advice! How far is Tufts? They would definitely have a hi res digital x-ray machine. If you have a local specialty vet practice (specialist vets who set up an office together to share equipment/overhead), they will likely have an orthopedist and a hi res machine. A large general practice may also have a hi res digital machine.

 

Send the x-ray to Dr. Couto (I believe he will be in this coming week). He is amazing. If you decide to come to OSU, we can put you up in a local greyhound owner's house so you don't have the hotel expense. We can also provide moral support.

 

Jane

[RedFawnMom]

So I just got off the phone with the vet Lucy usually sees, who is much more familiar with greys. She wasn't working yesterday so i called today and asked her to weigh in. She said the X-Ray looks cystic and she does not think cancer. She talked to another vet who saw Lucy yesterday when they brought her back for x-rays, and he told her he did not think cancer based on how she was moving and acting. He said dogs with osteo who come in with a limp are in much more pain. She said the Xray did not look cancerous, the lesion has defined edges and they didn't see any of the "starburst" or "moth eaten" qualities they tend to see with osteo. That said, these things just sometimes present unusually so we're not ruling it out completely.

 

It's not 100%, but the outlook seems much better. I have finally stopped crying.

 

She is going to photograph or scan the x-rays and send to Dr. Couto on Monday and also put them online on VIN - she said they will get opinions from multiple specialists. And putting her info there will help educate other vets since this is a bit unusual. I asked about a second set of x-rays and she said they have clear images, so getting a specialist's opinion first would be better. If Dr. Couto wants additional imaging, we will do it, absolutely, probably at Tufts since they have the best equipment in this region (they are about 2-3 hours away). So I know there is still a chance it could be osteo, but it seems less likely. If we rule out osteo, we will see an orthopedist about the cyst, but it would be much less of an emergency since they tend not to grow, or to grow very slowly, and the pain responds to NSAIDs very well (speaking from experience).

 

And she is improving and is getting up more. She still seems to be walking a bit oddly but it's not a limp. She came upstairs while I was in the shower, so I think the Metacam is helping.

 

I will keep you posted on what Dr. Couto says. Thank you all for the support and information, it means so much to me. I love greyhound people.

[tbhounds]

Glad you stopped crying -- sounds like you have an awesome vet. Please keep us posted when you hear back from Dr Couto. I'll be thinking of you both. Hugs to Lucy

[Guest Energy11]

All GOOD NEWS!! I am happy for you and Lucy!

 

I really have a good feeling about this :-) Many hugs and prayers for you two!

[NeylasMom]

All very good news. 4 is very young to get osteo so hoping that your vet is right!

[Guest roselle]

An MRI is going to cost a lot of money and I'm not sure it will get you the answers you need. I agree with Trudy. A second set of xrays or at least get OSU to read the current xrays. Are they digital xrays?

 

They are not digital. I don't know what to do to get OSU to read them, I guess I would have to mail them. I did send them an Email but of course it's Friday night. What would a second set of Xrays show that this set didn't (they sedated her, so I don't think there were any images they weren't able to get)? The vet suggested MRI because it could differentiate between cyst and osteo. We have insurance for her, I don't know if it covers MRI, but if the MRI will be beneficial we will pay for it. I am not opposed to a second set of Xrays, but I don't want to put her through the sedation for Xrays again if it's not going to be enough for a diagnosis.

'

I would call OSU and talk to someone, tell them what's going on with you and the dog let them get new films if they can't read to ones you have. Under your circumstances I'll bet they get you in right away. Good luck.

Roselle and gracy

[Guest Stripeyfan]

No advice, but sending lots of good thoughts and hugs.

[Charlies_Dad]

That is definitely better news based on the second/third opinion. We'll keep hoping it is a bone cyst!

[Guest kydie]

So, happy you are feeling better,,,, keep us posted,, I look for your new post everyday,, and am keeping my fingers crossed for Miss Lucy

[RedFawnMom]

Just a quick update - she seems almost 100% back to normal today. She's trying to romp around and play with toys (I am being a mean mom and not letting her...the vet said to keep her quiet until we have more answers), is not hanging out in her bed more than normal, is very interested in food. She even did a big stretch - it still looks to me like she's rotating that leg a little bit, but my husband doesn't see it. I know that with my cyst, I unconsciously adjusted the way I walk on that foot to put the pressure on a different part of the ankle, and that's sort of what I see in her.

 

So, all good signs, but we're still taking it seriously. I'll call OSU tomorrow and keep you posted.

 

Thanks for keeping her in your thoughts, we really appreciate it.