Greyhound Playday - Someone Joined Our Group W/ Ig?

[Guest BorzoiMom]

"I do not blame the IG owner either. A lot of people own dogs, especially toy dogs, and do not know the first thing about DOGS."

 

I have to respectfully disagree here. If you don't take the time to learn about dogs you have no business owning one. It is entirely your responsibility to learn everything there is to learn about a new life brought into your household. In this day and age information is literally at your fingertips, IMO there is no excuse for not being aware of how fragile an IG is, just look at one, they have twigs for legs.

 

Seems like common sense to me, but we all know that is on the endangered species list.

[Guest Swifthounds]

I have to respectfully disagree here. If you don't take the time to learn about dogs you have no business owning one. It is entirely your responsibility to learn everything there is to learn about a new life brought into your household. In this day and age information is literally at your fingertips, IMO there is no excuse for not being aware of how fragile an IG is, just look at one, they have twigs for legs.

 

Seems like common sense to me, but we all know that is on the endangered species list.

 

Yes, but humans have an amazing power to ignore common sense. Look at how many greyhound owners have to have a hound stitched up because they leave dogs in a home unmuzzled when they're gone, let them romp in the yard unmuzzled, etc. Surely, those people can see their hounds' sharp teeth and thin skin.

 

As much as the IG owner's ignorance played a part in the dog's injury, the owners of the greyhounds involved posed a threat to the small dog that goes above and beyond the threat posed by, say, a PWD.

[robinw]

I would probably chip in because I would feel bad about what happened. The IG owner probably didn't know much about dogs and others in the playgroup should have stopped her from entering. I think everybody was at fault but it could have been lack of knowledge, also.

[Guest leash]

Thanks for the advice. My husband said there is no way we are going to pay anything and that everyone on GT is correct. Can anyone help me with what should be in the waiver so that I can give it to our group organizer? I think if she does not put something in place then I will never attend her group again.

 

Do you all feel that only retired racers should play together only? As my greyhound did not race.

 

The whole reason we stopped going to the dog park was because people kept bring there out of control dogs or small dogs to the large dog park side. I thought this greyhound play group would be different. Maybe with some changes things will be different!

[Guest MnMDogs]

This isn't the Roseville meet up is it? We've never been, but that really surprises me that they would allow that. I agree...don't pay as you had the sense to remain out of the fray. If we showed up and saw 2 little dogs we would have turned around as well.

 

 

[Guest greybookends]

Thanks for the advice. My husband said there is no way we are going to pay anything and that everyone on GT is correct. Can anyone help me with what should be in the waiver so that I can give it to our group organizer? I think if she does not put something in place then I will never attend her group again.

 

Do you all feel that only retired racers should play together only? As my greyhound did not race.

 

The whole reason we stopped going to the dog park was because people kept bring there out of control dogs or small dogs to the large dog park side. I thought this greyhound play group would be different. Maybe with some changes things will be different!

It should be greyhounds only. It doesn't matter if they raced or not. NGA, AKC or just plain ol' greyhound, but it should be GREYHOUND only.

[Maddiesmom]

I don't attend our playgroup as the field has holes in (that we have offered to fill up) - (we have since stopped using the field due to this and due to this summer's weather) but also because my girl has a kind of "alpha female" mentality when she gets to running. We have a fence in our backyard so she runs in that. I choose not to attend as I know my dog and I don't want to cause harm to another's dog if someone goes wrong. We were outside the fence one time when we did go and one of the more submissive greys got a pack of the other greys to gang up on her. I tried to break it up from outside the fence and Maddie (if she was on the inside) would have been one of the dogs to gang up on this grey. I would not be able to live with myself if she did harm to another grey. Glad we were on the outside of the fence. we have a waiver that we have to sign. Plus playdate is on Saturday AM which is not really a good time for me. As it is errand time LOL.

 

I agree with the others that you should not pitch in, the IG owner should have seen that these were all greyhounds and NOT IGs that were in the playgroup. You voice your concerns prior to the playdate.

 

 

[Guest Swifthounds]

It should be greyhounds only. It doesn't matter if they raced or not. NGA, AKC or just plain ol' greyhound, but it should be GREYHOUND only.

 

Why GREYHOUND only? If they're muzzled and well behaved and in small enough groups with attentive owners (which is, I know, a bit like hoping for the tooth fairy, the Easter bunny, and Santa Clause to show up for Halloween, but I digress...) that's the important part.

[LadyGrey]

An IG???

 

Were you questioning the meaning of IG?? IG = Italian Greyhound.

 

Yes, thank you. These acronyms are sometimes hard to keep up with. LOL

I just learned that DH means Dear Hubby. LOL

[kudzu]

Why GREYHOUND only? If they're muzzled and well behaved and in small enough groups with attentive owners (which is, I know, a bit like hoping for the tooth fairy, the Easter bunny, and Santa Clause to show up for Halloween, but I digress...) that's the important part.

Short answer, because it is a GREYHOUND playgroup. Expanding on that, it is a Greyhound playgroup and the organizers want it Greyhounds only. There is a cause to be made for Greyhounds only. [stop reading now, because I just wrote a book again] Though your idea of involving Tooth Fairy & Santa Claus would be ideal, am thinking the Easter Bunny should stay outside the fence. Seriously though some Greys, for whatever reason, are great with Greys but do not like other breeds. Some Greys are aggressive to them, others are cautious or at the least uncomfortable. There are far, far more opportunities for dogs to run in mixed groups of breeds than to run with just Greyhounds. I like the idea of Greyhound only groups. It gives those Greys with OB socialization probs a place to play.

 

Groups of Greys running together can be hazardous to other breeds, unless Tooth Fairy & Santa Claus can make it. (Am enjoying conjuring up the image of them out with the Greys.) As the owner of a Greyhound mix & knowing a couple others I can tell you that unless they look like & act just like a Greyhound they stand a good chance of being treated differently amongst a group of Greyhounds. That can disturb even a confident, well socialized dog. Also, other breeds can be clueless in the ways of Greyhound running play. The more Greys, the greater risk to the OB. They seem to get run over with greater frequency by the Greyhounds. Perhaps OBs overestimate their own speed or misjudge Greys speed.

 

And there is simply the greater danger of coursing, packing up or predatory drift. True, predatory drift & packing up is possible with any dog or group of dogs regardless of breeds. (Am using 'predatory drift' with some hesitation as I've seen several definitions/descriptions so fear I could be misusing it.) I know these happen Grey on Grey, though in my brief 4 years in Greys I've only personally seen it once. It started as a squabble between two that led to a dog scream & then others jumped in. It was a pack, not coursing or predatory drift. However, I have seen Greys come together & course other breeds several times at parks when a group of Greys was running together & another breed of dog joins them or runs nearby. The speed and intensity with which it happened was very different than I'd seen of Greys out running together. No one was injured but each time it was close. Until one has seen the dynamic suddenly shift from fun run to a pack of Greys coursing the Lab or Dalmation or Lab/Grey or whatever. it is hard to understand how dangerous it could become in a millisecond. Just coursing isn't the biggest danger. Predatory drift is & I do not want my Staghound to be the recipient nor do I want my Grey to be part of the pack.

 

This extends to other sighthounds breeds, IME the shaggy coated ones have the worse time. Have seen it happen to my Staghound, an Afghan & a large Silken Windhound. And I cannot for the life of me understand why any Greyhound person would let their dog loose when IG's were on the field. Pure insanity if you have ever in your life seen Greys running, even one at a time. Heck my parents 35 lb mutt was accidentally bruised & banged up by my Grey when it was just the two of them in my yard. One zigged. Other zagged. Next thing you know Blossom was about to be t-boned when Venus jumped but still managed to clip her. Poor Blossom barrel rolled, 4-5 times over. She was sore for days after. Now when Venus runs, Blossom immediately sits & won't move.

 

The saddest, most frightening non-injury related event was when I foolishly turned my Staghound out with the Greys, all muzzled, at a Greyhound event. She was young, needed to run & I was just not thinking straight. Worse, I watched her for a second as she trotted & sniffed around but then turned to answer someone's question. My head was turned when she started to run. Someone called out to me & I turned around. The resulting convergence of Greys that started heading her way as she ran would have been very disturbing to watch even if it weren't my baby on the receiving end. I and someone else started running that way just as my staghound recognized what was happening. She curled in on herself as much as possible while running, trying to find a way out. I was still at least 25 yards away when 5+ Greys encircled her. More were ringing the scene by the time we got there to pull the dogs away. Don't bother berating me or asking what the heck I was thinking. I hate myself enough for having done that to her. Until that point I had not seen that sort of behavior when the OB was a large sighthound.

 

When I adopted my Grey & started taking her to the dog park I was thrilled if another Grey showed up. And still if there are only a 3 or so Greys things are fine. However, these days if a large group of Greys were there I would not let my Grey run if other breeds were around. My girl has proven safe with other breeds in all other situations but when running with Greys the whole picture changes. Unless there is a lure to zone in on & chase, when in running mode with other Greys my girl will find something else to use as the lure. I would still like to think she would not harm another dog but I don't want to find out. My worry is not just for the poorly chosen "lure" but for my girl should the "lure" understandably fight back.

Edited October 1, 2010 by kudzu

[Guest LindsaySF]

The person in charge of this playgroup is a complete and total idiot. There I said it. If anyone should be "chipping in" it's that person.

 

To the OP, I would tell the organizer that you did "chip in" - you warned the group that this was a bad idea.

Ditto.

 

IMHO the person "in charge" (sort of an oxymorn in retrospect) of the group that allowed that horrible event to happen should pay 1/2 the vet costs out of his/her pocket, then ask for donations from the other GH owners that were there to donate to ease the IG owners 1/2. The bulk of the blame in my mind lies with him/her. If you are going to run a rescue and/or playgroup you should be somewhat dog savvy and they obviously are not.

Ditto this too.

 

 

 

To the OP, I'm glad you had the sense not to enter with your dog. And I'm glad that you tried to warn people ahead of time what a bad idea the whole thing would be. Shame on the others for not listening to you. I hope the IG will be okay.

 

 

 

 

~Lindsay~

[Guest Swifthounds]

Why GREYHOUND only? If they're muzzled and well behaved and in small enough groups with attentive owners (which is, I know, a bit like hoping for the tooth fairy, the Easter bunny, and Santa Clause to show up for Halloween, but I digress...) that's the important part.

Short answer, because it is a GREYHOUND playgroup. Expanding on that, it is a Greyhound playgroup and the organizers want it Greyhounds only. There is a cause to be made for Greyhounds only. [stop reading now, because I just wrote a book again] Though your idea of involving Tooth Fairy & Santa Claus would be ideal, am thinking the Easter Bunny should stay outside the fence. Seriously though some Greys, for whatever reason, are great with Greys but do not like other breeds. Some Greys are aggressive to them, others are cautious or at the least uncomfortable. There are far, far more opportunities for dogs to run in mixed groups of breeds than to run with just Greyhounds. I like the idea of Greyhound only groups. It gives those Greys with OB socialization probs a place to play.

 

Groups of Greys running together can be hazardous to other breeds, unless Tooth Fairy & Santa Claus can make it. (Am enjoying conjuring up the image of them out with the Greys.) As the owner of a Greyhound mix & knowing a couple others I can tell you that unless they look like & act just like a Greyhound they stand a good chance of being treated differently amongst a group of Greyhounds. That can disturb even a confident, well socialized dog. Also, other breeds can be clueless in the ways of Greyhound running play. The more Greys, the greater risk to the OB. They seem to get run over with greater frequency by the Greyhounds. Perhaps OBs overestimate their own speed or misjudge Greys speed.

 

And there is simply the greater danger of coursing, packing up or predatory drift. True, predatory drift & packing up is possible with any dog or group of dogs regardless of breeds. (Am using 'predatory drift' with some hesitation as I've seen several definitions/descriptions so fear I could be misusing it.) I know these happen Grey on Grey, though in my brief 4 years in Greys I've only personally seen it once. It started as a squabble between two that led to a dog scream & then others jumped in. It was a pack, not coursing or predatory drift. However, I have seen Greys come together & course other breeds several times at parks when a group of Greys was running together & another breed of dog joins them or runs nearby. The speed and intensity with which it happened was very different than I'd seen of Greys out running together. No one was injured but each time it was close. Until one has seen the dynamic suddenly shift from fun run to a pack of Greys coursing the Lab or Dalmation or Lab/Grey or whatever. it is hard to understand how dangerous it could become in a millisecond. Just coursing isn't the biggest danger. Predatory drift is & I do not want my Staghound to be the recipient nor do I want my Grey to be part of the pack.

 

This extends to other sighthounds breeds, IME the shaggy coated ones have the worse time. Have seen it happen to my Staghound, an Afghan & a large Silken Windhound. And I cannot for the life of me understand why any Greyhound person would let their dog loose when IG's were on the field. Pure insanity if you have ever in your life seen Greys running, even one at a time. Heck my parents 35 lb mutt was accidentally bruised & banged up by my Grey when it was just the two of them in my yard. One zigged. Other zagged. Next thing you know Blossom was about to be t-boned when Venus jumped but still managed to clip her. Poor Blossom barrel rolled, 4-5 times over. She was sore for days after. Now when Venus runs, Blossom immediately sits & won't move.

 

The saddest, most frightening non-injury related event was when I foolishly turned my Staghound out with the Greys, all muzzled, at a Greyhound event. She was young, needed to run & I was just not thinking straight. Worse, I watched her for a second as she trotted & sniffed around but then turned to answer someone's question. My head was turned when she started to run. Someone called out to me & I turned around. The resulting convergence of Greys that started heading her way as she ran would have been very disturbing to watch even if it weren't my baby on the receiving end. I and someone else started running that way just as my staghound recognized what was happening. She curled in on herself as much as possible while running, trying to find a way out. I was still at least 25 yards away when 5+ Greys encircled her. More were ringing the scene by the time we got there to pull the dogs away. Don't bother berating me or asking what the heck I was thinking. I hate myself enough for having done that to her. Until that point I had not seen that sort of behavior when the OB was a large sighthound.

 

When I adopted my Grey & started taking her to the dog park I was thrilled if another Grey showed up. And still if there are only a 3 or so Greys things are fine. However, these days if a large group of Greys were there I would not let my Grey run if other breeds were around. My girl has proven safe with other breeds in all other situations but when running with Greys the whole picture changes. Unless there is a lure to zone in on & chase, when in running mode with other Greys my girl will find something else to use as the lure. I would still like to think she would not harm another dog but I don't want to find out. My worry is not just for the poorly chosen "lure" but for my girl should the "lure" understandably fight back.

 

 

Which is the long way of saying that there are greyhound owners that don't bother to properly socialize their greyhounds, teach them manners, or supervise them - and don't want to do so.

[Guest mbfilby]

My opinion has already been stated by others.. repeatedly.. but it was irresponsible for the other grey owners to run their dogs with the IG out there. We all know the story about Robin's group and the ramifications of greyhounds being greyhounds with small dogs.

 

OP, you did the right thing and if I were you, I would not feel even remotely obligated to contribute to the vet costs. I would also re-think your association with this group. If they collectively could not see the potential for disaster with this situation, there is a serious lack of foresight, education, or experience.

 

I would never trust our hounds with a small animal in a play run situation. Even muzzled, Mickey likes swat and pounce her "prey".

[kudzu]

Which is the long way of saying that there are greyhound owners that don't bother to properly socialize their greyhounds, teach them manners, or supervise them - and don't want to do so.

Or perhaps they do not realize that it is a socialization issue that could be handled with work. Or if they do, but they do not know how to go about it &/or have someone appropriate to help them. It is not a small job. I strongly encourage people to do this but am also realistic. Even if they are working on it, it is helpful to have a safe outlet for their dog's energy, desire to run, plus it is physically healthy for the dog. I am not making excuses for people who will not bother to train or socialize their dogs but it can be a big task that is poorly understood & frequently mishandled. Socialization and counter conditioning can have big payoffs but it can be very hard work that is rather easy for the average Joe, like me, to mess up. (And I am one who has been working on this with a staghound.) There can also be a bit more to the picture than just socialization. My Greyhound is very well socialized but instinct can kick in so I remain cautious with her. Socialization does not teach a dog how to corner or dodge well enough to avoid all collisions. Just this Saturday one of my dogs ran into another one. It was staghound & doodle playing together. The doodle was completely caught off guard by the staghound's speed. There were only 3 dogs around, not a big group. The two who collided were approx. the same weight. Still one dog ended up briefly limping & sore simply because he had no idea his new friend was so fast. (Um... That's the long way of saying, "Sure you are right but there's more to the story.")

 

That is beside the point in this situation, even though I wrote the book that spurred your response. It does not take away from the simple fact that tiny Iggies & big Greyhounds have no business running together. It is dangerous. The OP was wise to leave her dogs on the sidelines. I do sincerely hope the Iggie will recover without lasting damage.

[krissn333]

This whole situation was just irresponsible all around. While I do allow my IG to be outside with MY greyhounds, I would never turn him loose at a greyhound playgroup. That's just insanity. When I first adopted him, I didn't turn him loose with my dogs either. They didn't know him and he didn't know them. A little dog is a huge draw of attention and then the greyhounds turn into a big pack. Even if they don't intend to hurt the little one, they sure as heck can scare him to the point where he might try to bite, which then causes more problems.

 

My dogs know their little buddy now and treat him as they treat each other, and we've never had any issues there at all.

 

Couldn't the woman with the IG see that her dog was petrified?

 

OP did the right thing by saying something to the person "in charge." It was up to that person to speak to this woman and respectfully say that this was probably not a very good idea, and while they have no problem with other breeds, it's just NOT safe for the little IG to be out there with a pack of greyhounds.

 

We've been to the dog park and I won't go anymore. The style of play of labs and boxers is SO different from greyhound play style...I much prefer to let my greys play with other greys. Thankfully my parents have a fenced acre that I can take my dogs to now, so they can run to their hearts' content without worrying about other breeds getting carried away and their idiot owners not paying attention.

[Guest Swifthounds]

My own greyhounds have a large T shaped section of yard. Along the long portion of the "T" is the house on one side and the IG yard on the other. The "big dog yard" and the "Iggy yard" are parallel so that they can socialize, but the IGs cannot get underfoot of any of the greyhounds. I would never have them mix in the yard; too easy for an accident to happen with an IG underfoot. The IGs worship the greyhounds and don't know their own size and limits. The greyhounds are very careful with the IGs and very patient, but accidents happen and as upset as I would be if one of the hounds injured an IG it would be nothing compared to how the hound would feel.

[RileysLegacy]

This whole situation was just irresponsible all around. While I do allow my IG to be outside with MY greyhounds, I would never turn him loose at a greyhound playgroup. That's just insanity. When I first adopted him, I didn't turn him loose with my dogs either. They didn't know him and he didn't know them. A little dog is a huge draw of attention and then the greyhounds turn into a big pack. Even if they don't intend to hurt the little one, they sure as heck can scare him to the point where he might try to bite, which then causes more problems.

 

My dogs know their little buddy now and treat him as they treat each other, and we've never had any issues there at all.

 

Couldn't the woman with the IG see that her dog was petrified?

 

OP did the right thing by saying something to the person "in charge." It was up to that person to speak to this woman and respectfully say that this was probably not a very good idea, and while they have no problem with other breeds, it's just NOT safe for the little IG to be out there with a pack of greyhounds.

 

We've been to the dog park and I won't go anymore. The style of play of labs and boxers is SO different from greyhound play style...I much prefer to let my greys play with other greys. Thankfully my parents have a fenced acre that I can take my dogs to now, so they can run to their hearts' content without worrying about other breeds getting carried away and their idiot owners not paying attention.

Totally agree. I have 2 IGs and I never in a million years would let them play with a pack of greyhounds. I also have a greyhound and I never in a million years would let him play with a pack of greyhounds and a couple IGs. He is fine with them alone, but a pack situation is completely different. STUPID all around.

 

I just hope some of these people got a wake-up call and will use their brains in the future. This story is amazing to me - wait, actually it isn't.

 

I've never lived in an area with enough greyhounds to attend playgroups, but I can understand the argument for the group to be greyhounds only. It is important to me that my dogs be socialized with other breeds (and they are), but it gets to be a whole different ballgame when you have different energy levels, play styles, etc. The times at Dewey when Riley participated in the hund run are absolutely some of my favorite memories ever. It was amazing to watch a group of greyhounds doing what they were bred to do, for fun.

Edited October 5, 2010 by RileysMomma