Gracie Is Home

[Guest roselle]

Gracie is home after her l hind leg was amputated. She is doing pretty good healing physically, but emotionally she seems depressed and fearful of getting up and down from the floor. She is improving in endurance and stamina.. She can walk about 30 feet before she needs to rest but waits too long before going out side to pee, goes next to the door. I have her on a schedule, but if she won't get up for me there is nothing I can do. Are all greyhounds stubbern? What can I do for her?

Roselle

[Guest bigorangedog]

Glad to hear that your girl is healing well. Yes, it is common to see what seems like depression in these guys after amputations. Although, depending on how recent her amputation was, part of what you are seeing may be side effects from the medications. The opiate pain meds (like Tramadol and Morphine) can make them feel "loopy" or anxious. Meds can also make them very sedated. On the other hand, you need to keep her pain well under control, because she is also hesitant to get up because it's painful. So it's a balancing act with the meds.

 

Do you have slippery floors or stairs? If so, try to minimize those any way you can for now (with ramps, throw rugs, etc), and any other obstacles that may be in her path from her bed to the door. Or even move her "nest" closer to the door so she doesn't have as far to hop for a potty break.

 

If she is anxious (panting, fearful, whining), you might add some Valium to her medication protocol. Or think about reducing the opiate pain meds in favor of some NSAIDS or a neurotransmitter drug like Gabapentin.

 

Otherwise, just think about what things make her the happiest (whether it's car rides, Frosty Paws treats, sitting in the grass on a sunny day, hot dogs, whatever it is), and try to motivate her with those things. Fill her day with happy things so that she has some reason to try to get up and around again.

 

The first 2 weeks are by far the hardest, so it's definitely going to get better!!

[Guest roselle]

Glad to hear that your girl is healing well. Yes, it is common to see what seems like depression in these guys after amputations. Although, depending on how recent her amputation was, part of what you are seeing may be side effects from the medications. The opiate pain meds (like Tramadol and Morphine) can make them feel "loopy" or anxious. Meds can also make them very sedated. On the other hand, you need to keep her pain well under control, because she is also hesitant to get up because it's painful. So it's a balancing act with the meds.

 

Do you have slippery floors or stairs? If so, try to minimize those any way you can for now (with ramps, throw rugs, etc), and any other obstacles that may be in her path from her bed to the door. Or even move her "nest" closer to the door so she doesn't have as far to hop for a potty break.

 

If she is anxious (panting, fearful, whining), you might add some Valium to her medication protocol. Or think about reducing the opiate pain meds in favor of some NSAIDS or a neurotransmitter drug like Gabapentin.

 

Otherwise, just think about what things make her the happiest (whether it's car rides, Frosty Paws treats, sitting in the grass on a sunny day, hot dogs, whatever it is), and try to motivate her with those things. Fill her day with happy things so that she has some reason to try to get up and around again.

 

The first 2 weeks are by far the hardest, so it's definitely going to get better!!

[MandysMom]

No advice, just sending prayers for Gracie

[Guest Longdog]

Lots of cuddles and treats are the best medicine. Healing thoughts for Gracie.

[Guest roselle]

Gracie and I thank you for the healing messages.

[DesiRayMom]

Take good care of yourselves....prayers your way.

[Magdalyn58]

Sending prayers and positive thought from NEPA for Gracie and her family.

[Charlies_Dad]

Roselle,

 

Jen's response is spot on. Gracie is affected by the drugs so 'your' Gracie is not back yet. Also there can be some side affects emotionally and the best thing to do for them is: 1) don't let them see you down as they can detect this, 2) encourage her to do more (have a treat ready when she does well) and 3) do the things that make her happy (again just like Jen stated above). She will come out of her shell, some take longer than others and usually coming off most of the drugs helps tremendously. However for now she needs them for the pain and healing process. Also the only other things is try to stay ahead of the pain curve. If you need to increase dosage of a drug, speak to your vet to know which and how much in the event she experiences some extra pain during the healing process.

 

Good luck and it will get better. We are here for you so ask anytime.

Edited September 3, 2010 by Charlies_Dad

[sabrina]

Gracie I wish you the best on your road to recovery

[TheFullHouse]

Wishing a speedy recovery for Gracie.

[MerlinsMum]

I don't have any advice as I haven't been through this, but I wanted to send lots of good thoughts and wishes for a speedy recovery for Gracie. :goodluck

[fsugrad]

Sending prayers and healing thoughts out to Gracie and you.

[joejoesmom]

Roselle,

 

Great advice so far. I also wanted to add that she will be reluctant to get up because it hurts so may wait too long and have to go before she makes it to the door. This will end pretty soon. It also takes a little while for the IV fluids to get out of her system, causing her to need to go more often. Also, if she has edema (swelling due to extra fluid) she will need to go more often as this reduces. Lastly, if she continues to need to go more often than normal after a few days, be sure to call your vet. She may have developed a UTI (usually the antibiotics for the incision reduce the chances of a UTI, but my Joe developed one anyway.

 

Don't worry about this becoming a habit. That is very unlikely.

 

I also wanted to warn you that during the first week or two you will likely question if you did the right thing for her. This is normal. She will not seem like your dog for this period and will likely seem a bit depressed. All I can tell you is that she will return to normal Gracie soon, likely by 3 to 4 weeks post surgery.

 

Yesterday, Joe was completely his normal self. He played pounce on the stuffy and went out with me to get the mail (800 feet round trip). This is despite some lumbar stenosis. He is just 4 weeks post amp.

 

Please call me if you have any questions.

 

Jane

[nyGreys]

Sending prayers and healing thoughts to your girl.

[MaryJane]

You mentioned getting "up from the floor" and I may be taking this too literally but, is she on a flat dog bed (which will give her some traction as she gets up) or lying on the floor (which will be too slippery to get traction)? Are there enough non-skid rugs around that she feels "safe" to make her way to the door?

[Guest roselle]

Every day for the last week since Gracie has been home has been better then the last but today we took a step backwards. I realize that there are ups and downs but when it comes to pain it kills me to see her suffer. She won't take the tramadol (tablets), I've tried peanut butter, liverworst, cheese, chicken and no way will she swallow. I'll get the liquid form somewhere tomorrow, I can sneak the liquid in. My floors have been covered with indoor/outdoor carpeting everywhere, there's no slipping. When I said she had a hard time getting up from the floor I meant carpet, low flat padded dog bed, circle dog bed, and large 5 inch wide dog bed. We moved out coffee table and some chairs so she has freedom to move. Physically she gets up and down great only in the last 11/2 day she is crying while doing so. I've had some great comments with possible explanations for her behavior and all are helpful. Making it outside to go potty does seem to be a reluctance to get up and today only one accident. She is better because she gets frostygaws as a reward.

Jane I would love to talk again but I lost your phone number. If you can give it again I would like to call you. Jane I have been second guessing my decision to amputate. The amputation was so I could have more time with her, but I'm holding on to the words from this group, this is time limited and she will be out of pain soon.

 

Thanks to all your good prayers and good wishes, and back to you as well, Roselle

[Batmom]

Roselle, will she let you pill her? The classic way is to tilt dog's head back a little, open dog's mouth (wrap their upper lips around their teeth a smidge so they don't bite down), stick hand in mouth and put pill waaaaaaaaay down throat, close mouth and hold till they swallow. A sneakier way that works with many small pills is to offer a nice glob of peanutbutter, cream cheese, braunschweiger, or cheez whiz -- something good and sticky -- one one hand, and while pup is busy licking that off, poke pill into the corner of their mouth with your other hand. Sending hugs and best luck to you and your sweet girl.

[robinw]

Greenie's Pill Pockets work great for those who refuse to take pills.

[joejoesmom]

Every day for the last week since Gracie has been home has been better then the last but today we took a step backwards. I realize that there are ups and downs but when it comes to pain it kills me to see her suffer. She won't take the tramadol (tablets), I've tried peanut butter, liverworst, cheese, chicken and no way will she swallow. I'll get the liquid form somewhere tomorrow, I can sneak the liquid in. My floors have been covered with indoor/outdoor carpeting everywhere, there's no slipping. When I said she had a hard time getting up from the floor I meant carpet, low flat padded dog bed, circle dog bed, and large 5 inch wide dog bed. We moved out coffee table and some chairs so she has freedom to move. Physically she gets up and down great only in the last 11/2 day she is crying while doing so. I've had some great comments with possible explanations for her behavior and all are helpful. Making it outside to go potty does seem to be a reluctance to get up and today only one accident. She is better because she gets frostygaws as a reward.

Jane I would love to talk again but I lost your phone number. If you can give it again I would like to call you. Jane I have been second guessing my decision to amputate. The amputation was so I could have more time with her, but I'm holding on to the words from this group, this is time limited and she will be out of pain soon.

 

Thanks to all your good prayers and good wishes, and back to you as well, Roselle

 

My phone number is 614-523-0754. I am heading out to do a little bit more outdoor work until dark. I am so happy to finally have a cool day. I will be back in the house by 8:45 eastern time.

 

Jane

[Guest roselle]

I'm happy again, Gracie is so much better. She's sit to stand and stand to sit when I ask if she wants to go out and NO CRYING Her Gracie expressions are coming back and appetite too. Now what to do about chemo? Thanks to you all for getting us to this point.

Roselle and Gracie

[joejoesmom]

I'm happy again, Gracie is so much better. She's sit to stand and stand to sit when I ask if she wants to go out and NO CRYING Her Gracie expressions are coming back and appetite too. Now what to do about chemo? Thanks to you all for getting us to this point.

Roselle and Gracie

If you haven't been in contact with OSU, contact them now. They will suggest a course of treatment and will provide what chemo drugs they can. You will need to find a vet to administer the drugs. Some general practice vets have experience with this, some don't. Some of the chemo drugs are very nasty and should not be allowed to touch the dogs skin (or human skin of course). so it is very important that the IV catheter is placed securely and well taped down -- also that your dog doesn't move much. The actual time for the chemo to enter the bloodstream is just about 10 minutes. However, bloodwork will be done before each treatment so the actual time you dog will be at the vet will be longer.

 

Your Gracie will need to be checked for any heart or kidney issues. If she has either, it will dictate which chemo is appropriate. My Joe is getting doxorubicin, administered via IV at two week intervals for a total of 5 treatments. After that he is going on a combo of artemisinin, cytoxan, and Palladia.

 

There are various other treatments that are available.

 

Here is info on contacting OSU:

 

Here is info on how to contact Dr. Couto and his team. The email or phone consult is free, however a few people have been told they must sign up for the website ($50) and submit the request that way. Dr. Couto tells me that this is not true. However, if you are a member of their website, please submit your request that way because it will automate things and make record keeping for them easier. Certain chemo drugs are free; you would need to pay to have them administered.

 

Greyhound Health and Wellness Program

Ohio State University College of Veterinary Medicine

601 Vernon Tharp Street

Columbus, Ohio 43210

Phone: (614) 247-6757 or (614) 247-8490

Email: greyosu@osu.edu

Website: http://www.vet.ohio-state.edu/GHWP.htm (registration and fee now required to get full access to this site)

 

This email goes to the team. If Dr. Couto is traveling, you may get a quicker answer from one of his team members. Drs. Marin and Zaldivar typically respond to greyhound owners. The consult is free but if you can afford to support the program please do so. You can sign up for full access to the website ($99 per calendar year) or donate through the giving page on the website. If you decide to donate, you can double your money by giving through the Greyhound Project. Just go to this website and scroll down to the appropriate donation button: http://www.adopt-a-greyhound.org/donate.shtml. They will match the funds that you donate.

 

The Team:

 

Dr. Couto, Department Head, Greyhound Medicine, Oncology and Hematology

Dr. Lili Marin, Greyhound Health and Oncology

Dr. Sara Zaldivar, Greyhound Health and Oncology

Dr. William Kisselberth, Oncology

Dr. Cheryl London, Oncology

Dr. Cristina Iazbik, Blood Bank Director and Hematologist

Dr. Bridget Urie, Oncology Resident

Dr. Matt Sherger, Oncology Resident

Dr. Joelle Fenger, Oncology Resident

Dawn Hudson, Vet Tech

Ashley DeFelice, Vet Tech

Stacey Gallant, Vet Tech

 

Drs Marin and Zaldivar are originally from Spanish speaking countries. If you have trouble understanding them over the phone, you might ask for one of the other vets or vet techs to “translate”.

 

Dr. Couto's direct email is:

couto.1@osu.edu

His phone number is also 614-247-6757. If he is in town, he typically returns emails in the early hours of the morning.

 

You should know that (in my humble opinion) they need more staff. Unfortunately finances do not permit it at this time. They do 20 to 30 greyhound consults a day along with all of their "in canine" patients. Depending on their workload there may be a wait for the consultation. If you are contacting them on an emergency basis, please let them know.

If you want to make an appointment to be seen in person/canine, you can call the main number to set up a date/time. The main number for the veterinary hospital is 614-292-3551.

 

If you decide to visit OSU please contact me. I may be able to put you up in a local home, provide moral support, or just help with logistics:

 

Finewhipador-drool@yahoo.com