Today Is The Day

[robinw]

[Burpdog]

Sending prayers for peace and comfort

[rycezmom]

Hang in there. You know you have the thoughts and prayers of an entire greyhound community behind you. That's an abundance of faith and hope for Wilbur.

 

L.

[Guest MyBoys]

You and sweet Wilbur are in my thoughts and prayers.

[tbhounds]

I'm sorry you didn't get the outcome you were hoping for. What did the Dr suggest to do now? I'm sure you both know that there is a bone tumor lurking in there--that's why the bone crumbled onto it's self. Were you able to get chest rads??

Poor Wilbur--I know how hard the last few weeks have been on you both.

 

I wanted to add that I really hope I'm wrong--truly.

Edited February 1, 2010 by tbhounds

[Guest LindsaySF]

I'm sorry to hear that. Do the bone changes look like cancer, or like an infection and inability to heal?

 

I know you like your vet, but maybe an orthopedic specialist would help? Perhaps a bone graft and different hardware instead of the rod?

Edited February 1, 2010 by LindsaySF

[crazygang]

No advice....

Just wanted to say sorry you and your special boy are going through this awful situation....

[GreyPoopon]

 

[Guest FastDogsOwnMe]

Oh no!

[Guest BorzoiMom]

How frustrating. Sorry you have to go through this.

[Neighsayer]

HUGS!

[brandimom]

You are both in my heart and prayers!!!!!!!!

[MP_the4pack]

Aw cwap.

[CaliforniaGreys]

Hang in there. You know you have the thoughts and prayers of an entire greyhound community behind you. That's an abundance of faith and hope for Wilbur.

 

L.

[RobinM]

Oh no. I am so very sorry.

[Guest Energy11]

We are thinking of you and Wilbur! Sending lots of love and prayers your way!

Hoping for a GOOD outcome! Love ya!

 

 

[Guest mcsheltie]

Praying for the both of you. I will also be praying that God will give the vet the idea needed for a positive outcome!

[45MPHK9]

thinking about you and your dear sweet boy. wish the news was better for wilbur.

[Guest Adrianne]

Thank you everyone for your good thoughts; it means so much. I'm sorry I haven't gotten back to this thread before now, but I just haven't had the heart. My mood changes almost hourly today it seems. I go from hopeful to despair just like that.

 

 

 

I'm sorry to hear that. Do the bone changes look like cancer, or like an infection and inability to heal?

 

I know you like your vet, but maybe an orthopedic specialist would help? Perhaps a bone graft and different hardware instead of the rod?

 

 

The bone changes look like cancer to me. I didn't have to look hard to see it; it's a pretty big area. Beth (Smiley) described it best by saying the look is almost like a cloud, and my vet called it moth-like. It's above the break right at the hip. Wilbur has also lost 16 pounds in the last seven weeks and is down to 70 pounds. His racing weight was 82 pounds. I don't know if the weight loss means anything, and I don't know how much of that is loss of muscle in that leg.

 

My husband and I were in the room today for the xrays. If you've ever suspected that your dog goes through a tough time to have his or her limbs manipulated for xrays, it's true. Wilbur's back end might as well have been a wishbone with the technician pulling on one side and the vet pulling on the other. As soon as the first xray was put on the light box, Dr. Sigman called for another view higher up on the hip. I looked over at the xray, and even from across the room, I could see the bone was still broken.

 

Yes, I do like my vet, but I didn't like him too much today. I love and adore my husband, but I didn't like him too much today either. I felt like I was the only adult in the room, and I wanted to grab both of them by the shoulders and shake them. They kept discussing the break, and I kept trying to bring the conversation around to the mottled area of the bone. I kept getting the brush off and talked to (by both of them) like I was just looking for a problem. Dr. Sigman said something about all the drainage Wilbur had had and said something about that affecting what we were seeing in that area. I kept questioning and pushing, and he did finally concede that yes, it could be cancer. He said though, that you usually see a tumor with bone cancer and we didn't see that. Well, usually is not always. It was very frustrating.

 

The rod was not removed, and Wilbur goes back in two weeks for more xrays.

 

Rats! I'm so very sorry.

 

I have no idea if this is relevant, but I'll share what happened with my Italian greyhound's broken leg. The first vet pinned it after splintering his bone attempting to put in a plate. Fast forward two months, it hadn't healed. I found a surgical specialist who removed the pin, plated it, and added bone graft to help it heal. Fast forward two months and it's healed well. He doesn't have full use of the leg but the broken bone is healed.

 

The point? Little Merlin had loss of bone during that time from being splinted and not using it. The bone in the wrist was significantly less dense than the rest of his bones.

 

I don't know if that's relevant to you, as I've said, but hopefully it's something like that for your boy. If the bone is overlapping, can they plate it?

 

Just a few thoughts, major HUGS to you both, and best of luck as you move forward.

 

 

I appreciate you sharing that with me, and it does give me some hope. Wilbur is not in any more pain today than he was seven weeks ago. I know bone cancer is supposed to be extremely painful.

 

So, where do we go from here? Well, unfortunately, my husband and I are on complete opposite ends of the spectrum when it comes to that question. I wish it weren't like that, but it is. As it was pointed out to me today, Wilbur is already a tripod. He doesn't use that leg at all. He's already learned how to get up and down and around with just one back leg. If anything, I think that would work in his favor in recovering from amputation. My husband is against the idea. I know it's a very personal decision, but what do you do when the house is divided. We had a very heated discussion about it this evening, and one of us will probably be sleeping on the couch tonight. As I said, I love my husband, and I'm not going to talk badly about him, but I am very frustrated with him tonight. I can't go ahead with an amputation by myself, which is what my choice would be. It has to be a team decision and effort here.

 

I do know Wilbur has a lot more living in him. When I got his leash out this morning, he got right up. When we took him out to the truck, he got both front legs in the truch without us lifting him. He then waited for us to lift his back end. I was so proud of him.

Edited February 2, 2010 by Adrianne

[Batmom]

Just wrapping you and Wilbur up in big bunches of cyberhugs.

[tbhounds]

Please--I urge you to run--don't walk to another vet. To let this go on w/o any further treatment is not helping your boy. The bone is not going to heal. Sorry if this sounds harsh but, really what in the world is your Dr thinking?? If he evens thinks he might not be healing properly does he really think that another 2 weeks will make a difference?? I know this has been an emotional rollercoaster for you and I know how hard it is (believe me, I'm on that same coaster with my girl)but, to do nothing for the next 2 weeks is unfair to your boy. Sorry to sound blunt--never been much to sugar coat but, I truly have your boy's best interest at heart.

[Guest vahoundlover]

[LuvAPuppy]

Thank you everyone for your good thoughts; it means so much. I'm sorry I haven't gotten back to this thread before now, but I just haven't had the heart. My mood changes almost hourly today it seems. I go from hopeful to despair just like that.

 

 

 

I'm sorry to hear that. Do the bone changes look like cancer, or like an infection and inability to heal?

 

I know you like your vet, but maybe an orthopedic specialist would help? Perhaps a bone graft and different hardware instead of the rod?

 

 

The bone changes look like cancer to me. I didn't have to look hard to see it; it's a pretty big area. Beth (Smiley) described it best by saying the look is almost like a cloud, and my vet called it moth-like. It's above the break right at the hip. Wilbur has also lost 16 pounds in the last seven weeks and is down to 70 pounds. His racing weight was 82 pounds. I don't know if the weight loss means anything, and I don't know how much of that is loss of muscle in that leg.

 

My husband and I were in the room today for the xrays. If you've ever suspected that your dog goes through a tough time to have his or her limbs manipulated for xrays, it's true. Wilbur's back end might as well have been a wishbone with the technician pulling on one side and the vet pulling on the other. As soon as the first xray was put on the light box, Dr. Sigman called for another view higher up on the hip. I looked over at the xray, and even from across the room, I could see the bone was still broken.

 

Yes, I do like my vet, but I didn't like him too much today. I love and adore my husband, but I didn't like him too much today either. I felt like I was the only adult in the room, and I wanted to grab both of them by the shoulders and shake them. They kept discussing the break, and I kept trying to bring the conversation around to the mottled area of the bone. I kept getting the brush off and talked to (by both of them) like I was just looking for a problem. Dr. Sigman said something about all the drainage Wilbur had had and said something about that affecting what we were seeing in that area. I kept questioning and pushing, and he did finally concede that yes, it could be cancer. He said though, that you usually see a tumor with bone cancer and we didn't see that. Well, usually is not always. It was very frustrating.

 

The rod was not removed, and Wilbur goes back in two weeks for more xrays.

 

Rats! I'm so very sorry.

 

I have no idea if this is relevant, but I'll share what happened with my Italian greyhound's broken leg. The first vet pinned it after splintering his bone attempting to put in a plate. Fast forward two months, it hadn't healed. I found a surgical specialist who removed the pin, plated it, and added bone graft to help it heal. Fast forward two months and it's healed well. He doesn't have full use of the leg but the broken bone is healed.

 

The point? Little Merlin had loss of bone during that time from being splinted and not using it. The bone in the wrist was significantly less dense than the rest of his bones.

 

I don't know if that's relevant to you, as I've said, but hopefully it's something like that for your boy. If the bone is overlapping, can they plate it?

 

Just a few thoughts, major HUGS to you both, and best of luck as you move forward.

 

 

I appreciate you sharing that with me, and it does give me some hope. Wilbur is not in any more pain today than he was seven weeks ago. I know bone cancer is supposed to be extremely painful.

 

So, where do we go from here? Well, unfortunately, my husband and I are on complete opposite ends of the spectrum when it comes to that question. I wish it weren't like that, but it is. As it was pointed out to me today, Wilbur is already a tripod. He doesn't use that leg at all. He's already learned how to get up and down and around with just one back leg. If anything, I think that would work in his favor in recovering from amputation. My husband is against the idea. I know it's a very personal decision, but what do you do when the house is divided. We had a very heated discussion about it this evening, and one of us will probably be sleeping on the couch tonight. As I said, I love my husband, and I'm not going to talk badly about him, but I am very frustrated with him tonight. I can't go ahead with an amputation by myself, which is what my choice would be. It has to be a team decision and effort here.

 

I do know Wilbur has a lot more living in him. When I got his leash out this morning, he got right up. When we took him out to the truck, he got both front legs in the truch without us lifting him. He then waited for us to lift his back end. I was so proud of him.

 

You do need a second veterinary opinion. Not because your vet is a bad vet, he likely isn't. There comes a time for fresh eyes. Be it someone near where you are or Dr Couto at Ohio State or any other large university vet, someone with no case knowledge needs to see ALL of Wilbur's films from the day of the break to present.

 

the sad fact is there may very well be cancer in there. Or the bone changes may be just due to blood supply loss and non weight bearing. Osteoporitic women are prescribed weight bearing exercise to build bone. Wilbur hasn't weight borne for 7 long weeks. Bone loss is likely. I will confess to being concerned that it sounds like perhaps there weren't films done every few weeks? Um, if there weren't (and maybe I'm forgetting, you've been through a lot) There should have been. That's SOP at least in human medicine.

 

I would not wait 2 weeks before getting a fresh perspective. The opinion may be the same as your current vet. Or the consult vet may see something else. Wilbur needs this. You guys aren't bad pet parents (just in case you were thinking you are) and your vet isn't a bad guy, maybe he's in over his head or maybe this is just one of those bizarre cases.

 

 

<how can I read this three times and not notice the typo until AFTER I post )

Edited February 2, 2010 by LuvAPuppy

[Guest LindsaySF]

I would get a second opinion also. Whether it is cancer or not, I think a fresh set of eyes would help. Good luck.

[KF_in_Georgia]

If Wilbur isn't using the leg, he's functionally a tripod. I can see the virtue of not risking the hazards of anesthesia to remove the bad leg if--and only if--it can be made essentially pain-free. If, perhaps, the nerve is dead or something, so that the hardware could be removed, of if it could be immobilized with a sling so that Wilbur could run around and not be at risk of injuring himself. But if the leg is in the way--so that it limits Wilbur's mobility or pains him when he moves--that's a good argument for amputation.

 

Has your vet explained what he expects to happen in the next two weeks that hasn't happened in the last two months? Is he expecting a miracle? Does he think two non-connected portions of bone are going to somehow bridge the gap? If he can't give you a cogent reason for the wait, I'd be hunting for a second opinion right away. Actually, I might be hunting for that second opinion even if the vet does have a master plan. Someone needs to evaluate what risks of additional harm there might be from doing a wait-and-see for two more weeks. And you need an expert to look at the shadows on the x-ray, because if those shadows are cancer, those two weeks might be too long.

 

Perhaps you and your husband can just table the question of amputation until you can get Wilbur to another vet. What another vet says about the soundness of Wilbur's leg is likely to influence what you do.

 

Best wishes to you all in the days ahead.