We've Hit A "wall" With A Foster

[sobesmom]

Our current foster has been with us for over 2 months. He was sent here - for boot camp.

 

He's a great dog - but very young - quite dominant acting - super pushy. He was sent here to lean some "manners". OH YEAH. WOW. You couldn't get a bit of food out without him trying to tackle you to take it. Not just be interested and come too close - literally CLIMB on you to grab it! He couldn't have a toy without trying to kill the other dogs for it. A chew bone - forget it! And - he'd eat his food - and "mark" his bowl IMMEDIATELY! EEK!!!! And - try to "mark" any time any dog or person bothered him!

 

Now - he's come SO FAR. He doesn't bother people trying to eat their food. He doesn't bother the other dogs at dog eating times. He plays, like crazy- happy - happy -happy!!! He can have toys all the time - they're all over the house now. He picks them up , plays, then drops them. Another dog might pick it up, he doesn't care. All 3 dogs get rawhide chews every day - no issues.

 

We're VERY VERY proud of how far he's come.

 

BUT - I think we've hit a wall. He's still got some issues. He wants to "mark" sometimes. Even right in front of me! Not all the time - but still once in a while. And - when we leave - he still occasionally pees a little in the kitchen. Just a little "squirt". And - he's still got some "pseudo - dominant" tendancies. He was sleeping the other day, and was in the way - so I gently woke him up. Made sure he was REALLY awake, talked to him, petted him, etc. Then asked him to move. He didn't. Commanded - he didn't. Spoke loudly - and he came up snapping and growling. That got him RREMOVED - scolded - and the dogbed taken away from that location. Momma don't take crap.

 

Also - last night, my grey Sobe, who is injured, got off the couch, slipped on the laminate flor, and was kinda sprawled out, hurting and trying to get his footing. DH immediately get under Sobe and lifted him to help him out - the foster ran up and tried to snap at Sobe. Basically - trying to hurt a dog that was down. DH smacked him in the nose.

 

We've hit a wall with this dog. We've brought him a LONG way - but now - I don't know what to do. Ask for him to go to another foster home that might be better than we can do? Adopt him out - with a TON of stipulations? BTW - not a lot of people lining up to adopt a big male, not cat safe, not small kid safe.

 

He's not awful - he's actually 99% of the time a very, very fun - happy outgoing dog. I just don't know what to do now. I've hit the limit of what I can do for him!

[Guest MyHoodies]

How many other dogs do you have in the house??? Maybe it is just an due to several dogs and might be better with only one other dog???

 

Do you muzzle him? Muzzles can/are our friends and are good tools for training. Also, try some belly bands for the marking which won't cure the problem but will at least save you on cleaning up.

 

I can't say I have ever had a dominent issue with "boys" since Bacardi rules the house and puts them right in their place should ANYONE get out of hand, including fosters. She will be 11 this year and still rules with an iron paw.

 

Get a fly swatter. When he does something wrong, just yell NO and wave it around in the air. For some reason mine have always been afraid of the fly swatter; guess I used it once to kill a fly and they didn't like the sound that it made. All I have to do anymore is just touch it or pick it up and everyone goes running to find a place to lay down.

 

My Damion will growl / snap if you bother him while laying on the bed (doesn't even have to be sleeping) but he is muzzled all the time (chews and eats EVERYTHING so it is on for his safety). I just remove him from the bed when he does that. Sorry to say that months later.... he still does this but love him anyway.

 

I feel for you. My current foster is not good with small aninmals / small kids and will destroy any and all toys. I have had him for 4 months now. Sometimes it just takes a while to find the right home. They are out there.....

[Batmom]

BUT - I think we've hit a wall. He's still got some issues. He wants to "mark" sometimes. Even right in front of me! Not all the time - but still once in a while. And - when we leave - he still occasionally pees a little in the kitchen. Just a little "squirt".

 

That's usually pretty easy to resolve. Here, when somebody couldn't watch the dog (Joseph), we put him in his crate. Even if the "couldn't watch" period was 2.5 minutes. The person watching needs to be prepared to immediately "Ah-ah! Let's go OUT!" and convey dog outdoors if he lifts his leg.

 

And - he's still got some "pseudo - dominant" tendancies. He was sleeping the other day, and was in the way - so I gently woke him up. Made sure he was REALLY awake, talked to him, petted him, etc. Then asked him to move. He didn't. Commanded - he didn't. Spoke loudly - and he came up snapping and growling. That got him RREMOVED - scolded - and the dogbed taken away from that location. Momma don't take crap.

 

Wouldn't call that dominant, really. He was sleeping and didn't want to be disturbed. Think of how you would feel if somebody tried to roll you out of bed ..... I would work with him on the "Outta the way!" command using positive reinforcement. If you scold and take away his bed, he may get worse -- it shows him that bad things happen when people disturb his sleep, and that's the exact opposite of what you want. When someone has to move a dog who doesn't respond to that command yet, I always recommend snapping the leash on, turning *away* from the dog, cheerful firm "Let's go!", and stride off.

 

Also - last night, my grey Sobe, who is injured, got off the couch, slipped on the laminate flor, and was kinda sprawled out, hurting and trying to get his footing. DH immediately get under Sobe and lifted him to help him out - the foster ran up and tried to snap at Sobe. Basically - trying to hurt a dog that was down. DH smacked him in the nose.

 

Wouldn't smack him, unless just to brush him out of the way / break his focus which I realize might be necessary. Also wouldn't consider this an issue. It's a normal dog thing to attack / act aggressively toward a hurt animal, even if it's your foster brother. Why folks separate seizure dogs and injured dogs when they can't supervise.

 

Actually sounds to me like he's become a fine dog who may occasionally have an ordinary dog reaction to things. You've done a good job with him.

[greysmom]

I agree with Batmom about the bed issue. I wouldn't scold him, especially if he has snapping issues. Use it as an opportunity to teach him a command. We use "scoot" when we want them to move, but you can say whatever you want. Use a treat to lure him off his bed while saying the command.

 

His reaction to Sobe is a natural response to a weaker/sick dog. How is he on his own? Any Separation Anxiety? Some greys with this personality actually do better as an only dog in the house. It might be a good experiment to try if there is an only-dog foster available in your system.

 

No clue about the marking. Sorry.

[Guest GentleHugs]

Oh wow..... you have come a long way with this boy, haven't you?

 

Wish my Jackie were still here though - I'd lend her to you. She's at the bridge now. She was known for her "work" in the adoption kennel with the big boys who either kept humping everyone, marking everything or just plain bullying everyone else. I didn't know that at the time I adopted her but they would turn out the big boy muzzled then turn out little Jackie muzzled. She only stood 25 inches tall but she meant business, too, with her fiery little Irish temper. She could bring a big boy down on the ground making him say uncle in less than 10 seconds and afterwards they would never hump another dog or mark another thing. She wouldn't physically hurt them but she told them off big time! She was known as the "queen of all B****es in the adoption kennel!

 

Once I adopted her (because everyone else was afraid of her), she became an absolute sweetheart. Very obedient but still ruled the others with a iron paw. She knew house rules and one was not to run in the house. She caught my DH and Heisman running in the house one day playing and she told both of them off! DH was stunned and Heisman went straight to the futon, laid down and didn't get up until dinner time. He knew he was in trouble by Jackie!

 

I don't have any advice to give you though. I wish I did. Hopefully, with consistency and positive re-inforcement when he's a good boy will eventually turn him into a perfect boy.

[sobesmom]

Oh wow..... you have come a long way with this boy, haven't you?

 

Wish my Jackie were still here though - I'd lend her to you. She's at the bridge now. She was known for her "work" in the adoption kennel with the big boys who either kept humping everyone, marking everything or just plain bullying everyone else. I didn't know that at the time I adopted her but they would turn out the big boy muzzled then turn out little Jackie muzzled. She only stood 25 inches tall but she meant business, too, with her fiery little Irish temper. She could bring a big boy down on the ground making him say uncle in less than 10 seconds and afterwards they would never hump another dog or mark another thing. She wouldn't physically hurt them but she told them off big time! She was known as the "queen of all B****es in the adoption kennel!

 

Once I adopted her (because everyone else was afraid of her), she became an absolute sweetheart. Very obedient but still ruled the others with a iron paw. She knew house rules and one was not to run in the house. She caught my DH and Heisman running in the house one day playing and she told both of them off! DH was stunned and Heisman went straight to the futon, laid down and didn't get up until dinner time. He knew he was in trouble by Jackie!

 

I don't have any advice to give you though. I wish I did. Hopefully, with consistency and positive re-inforcement when he's a good boy will eventually turn him into a perfect boy.

 

Oh, I WISH I could borrow her. That's EXACTLY what this little "wanna-be" needs! My Sobe is usually the taskmaster in our house. All the fosters just seem to "listen" to him. He never gets aggressive - might only need to stand up, or make a low growl - if we get a particularly stupid one - I've seen Sobe back him down - just walk him backward - and the naughty dog ends up lying down - and behaving much better after that. Right now, Sobe's hurting, so, he's basically in hiding. So - no help from my bruiser! He's always done such a good job with this stuff - he speaks "dog" WAY better than me!

[sobesmom]

BUT - I think we've hit a wall. He's still got some issues. He wants to "mark" sometimes. Even right in front of me! Not all the time - but still once in a while. And - when we leave - he still occasionally pees a little in the kitchen. Just a little "squirt".

 

That's usually pretty easy to resolve. Here, when somebody couldn't watch the dog (Joseph), we put him in his crate. Even if the "couldn't watch" period was 2.5 minutes. The person watching needs to be prepared to immediately "Ah-ah! Let's go OUT!" and convey dog outdoors if he lifts his leg.

 

And - he's still got some "pseudo - dominant" tendancies. He was sleeping the other day, and was in the way - so I gently woke him up. Made sure he was REALLY awake, talked to him, petted him, etc. Then asked him to move. He didn't. Commanded - he didn't. Spoke loudly - and he came up snapping and growling. That got him RREMOVED - scolded - and the dogbed taken away from that location. Momma don't take crap.

 

Wouldn't call that dominant, really. He was sleeping and didn't want to be disturbed. Think of how you would feel if somebody tried to roll you out of bed ..... I would work with him on the "Outta the way!" command using positive reinforcement. If you scold and take away his bed, he may get worse -- it shows him that bad things happen when people disturb his sleep, and that's the exact opposite of what you want. When someone has to move a dog who doesn't respond to that command yet, I always recommend snapping the leash on, turning *away* from the dog, cheerful firm "Let's go!", and stride off.

 

Also - last night, my grey Sobe, who is injured, got off the couch, slipped on the laminate flor, and was kinda sprawled out, hurting and trying to get his footing. DH immediately get under Sobe and lifted him to help him out - the foster ran up and tried to snap at Sobe. Basically - trying to hurt a dog that was down. DH smacked him in the nose.

 

Wouldn't smack him, unless just to brush him out of the way / break his focus which I realize might be necessary. Also wouldn't consider this an issue. It's a normal dog thing to attack / act aggressively toward a hurt animal, even if it's your foster brother. Why folks separate seizure dogs and injured dogs when they can't supervise.

 

Actually sounds to me like he's become a fine dog who may occasionally have an ordinary dog reaction to things. You've done a good job with him.

 

You always give such good advice. Thank you. I DO believe that when I asked him to move, he should have. It was NOT in a normal dogbed spot, or normal place that's his place. And - I woke him up gently, talked to him, petted him,etc. When he was FULLY awake - I said "lets go" and pointed - a command he knows. He also knows "off" for furniture, and "back - back back " for back up, and "out" for go out of this room. All were taught with positive reinforcement. So - after trying "nice" - I went with FIRM. When firm got me no response - I moved him. No hard feelings, no punishment other than my saying sternly "you need to move" - but you CAN'T disobey a request, then a command - that you fully understand. IMHO. And - I only moved his bed 5 feet back to its normal position, which is not in front of the bathroom door, where he had dragged it and decided to lie on it. I probably didn't make any of that clear the first time.

 

As far as the other stuff - you're probably right on target. I don't know HOW many time I've told other people - If your dog pees in your house - it's problably YOUR FAULT for not WATCHING! I need to follow my own advice.

 

And DH smacking him in the nose - I didn't like that at all. We don't hit dogs, or people, or anything, in this house. He just panicked and reacted to what he saw - and probably was - the foster attacking Sobe at a time of weakness. He reacted. I understand that it's normal dog behaviour - your example of seizure dogs is a good one. But...it's scary and shocking the first time you see it. A real eye-opener!

 

Thanks again!!

 

ETA- The formatting is funny right now, so this post looks really weird, but I also wanted to say - THANK you also Batmom - for the nice comment and encouragement. He HAS come a long way - and maybe I've just gotten too used to "easy" dogs- and have forgotten that "stuff happens". Maybe these "issues" that I'm worrying about.... aren't really "issues"... just.... incidents... that .... happen.

Edited January 15, 2010 by sobesmom

[Patclara]

Maybe I missed this, but can you keep a belly band on him when he is in the house and you cannot watch him?

Just take it off him when he is outside to make?

At least he has been making progress, even if not in all areas and not quite perfect yet.

I think "making progress" is the most important thing with him.

It must be quite a challenge for you after all this time tho.

Another foster home who will keep enforcing the previous lessons, but continuing to work on the ongoing problems might be the answer.

I think I'd be tired at this point.