Seizure Testing

[Guest snakes]

I am wondering what sort or tests hounds undergo to figure seizures out. My boy has displayed some activity that they are guessing are seizures. We have had a full biochem/cbc profile done, just awaiting the results. Like any health issue there are tons of tests available, necessary or not. I am just wondering what others experiences have been through the myriad of tests that exist. thank you for all and any help.

[LBass]

There are no specific tests for epilepsy. It is generally diagnosed by ruling out everything else. When Piper's seizures started the vet did full blood work, 6 panel thyroid, tested for liver shunt, liver function, Cushing's and Addison's. All Piper's labs looked great, perfectly normal.

 

The next possibility was to look for a brain tumor via MRI. My vet at that time had an epileptic Dane of her own and I knew that she had a special perspective about caring for a dog with seizures. She had chosen not to get an MRI for her dog. After much thought and discussion, I felt comfortable that if there was serious brain disease at work, I would soon be seeing even more dramatic neurological symptoms and we would be able to recognize brain cancer w/o the MRI.

 

I did eventually take Piper to a neurologist but he concurred with what we had done in terms of testing and diagnosis and his contribution was mostly to refine Piper's medications.

 

Best of luck to you in dealing with your hound's seizures. Here are my 2 favorite resources for canine seizures of all kinds:

Guardian Angels and

Canine Epilepsy

A third site is also very helpful: Link #3

 

--Lucy and Piper (currently 3 weeks and 3 days seizure free)

[greypuppyluv]

We're just starting with the tests since Phaelin started having seizures about 3 weeks ago and at first, we did a full blood panel and a urinalysis. Phaelin's thyroid level was low so I took him in today to have a free T4 and TSH run.

 

I'm sure there will be others who can give you more info who have gotten further into the whole process.

[Guest snakes]

thanks guys, luckily he is not having 'serious' seizures, he doesn't get the twitching, is mostly standing rigid although slowly collapsing after being rigid, and is conscious although not responsive. the seizures also only last max 2 min.

Heard back and all labs are all normal, so unless there is a change we are just going to watch him and record details of any more (we've only seen 6 since august).

 

[duncan41]

Prayers for your boy.

[Guest MZH]

Sometimes one gets "lucky" and low thyroid is found to be the cause of seizures. Most of the time though, you never find out why it hits one dog and not another.

 

I'm wondering if they're really seizures. We did have one dog who kept passing out. We treated her for seizures but it didn't work because her problem turned out to be atrial fibrillation. How's his heart rate? Tabba's was over 180 when these "events" happened. Heart meds fixed her up nicely.

 

Great idea to keep a record.

 

Marcia

 

 

[Guest snakes]

I'm wondering if they're really seizures. We did have one dog who kept passing out. We treated her for seizures but it didn't work because her problem turned out to be atrial fibrillation. How's his heart rate? Tabba's was over 180 when these "events" happened. Heart meds fixed her up nicely.

 

Great idea to keep a record.

 

Marcia

 

 

I'll admit i never checked his HR. Now that i am keeping a log i am going to check HR and temp each time. Thanks for the suggestion. He isn't passing out at the momonet thank goodness!

[Guest PhillyPups]

I have never had testing done on mine, however if I had questions, I would go to my self-appointed "seizure expert" Judy (JillysFullHouse) and would start there. I am sure she would not mind a pm. She has had Saint seizure free for over 4 years now, and he is a hoot.

[Guest MZH]

 

 

I'll admit i never checked his HR. Now that i am keeping a log i am going to check HR and temp each time. Thanks for the suggestion. He isn't passing out at the momonet thank goodness!

 

The rub is that the HR may go up at seizure time but just checking periodically when he looks funky can give a clue about that too. I used to walk around with an inexpensive stethoscope around my neck and checked just "whenever!" It helped a lot to know what was normal and what wasn't.

 

Nowadays they even put Holter monitors on dogs. I just remembered that now and then Tabba looked like she was having an actual seizure, but that and the passing out stopped after she got the heart meds. We videotaped her doing it and brought the tape of the incident to the vet. He knew right away what it was!

 

Marcia

[Guest EmilyAnne]

The rub is that the HR may go up at seizure time but just checking periodically when he looks funky can give a clue about that too. I used to walk around with an inexpensive stethoscope around my neck and checked just "whenever!" It helped a lot to know what was normal and what wasn't.

 

Nowadays they even put Holter monitors on dogs. I just remembered that now and then Tabba looked like she was having an actual seizure, but that and the passing out stopped after she got the heart meds. We videotaped her doing it and brought the tape of the incident to the vet. He knew right away what it was!

 

Marcia

Yes this is true. I can visisbly see Henry's heart beating after a Grand-Mal seizure because his heart is pounding so hard. Did your vet say what type of seizures these may be? There are several types of seizures. The ones I am familiar with are Grand-Mal, Petit-Mal, and Focals. There's other types too though.

 

Everyone else has already answered the testing question pretty well, so I'll leave that alone. Just make sure you have a grehound savvy vet check your grey's thyroid, or your grey may be misdiagnosed like my Henry was.

 

 

[Guest snakes]

As far as we are aware they are focal seizures. He goes into a state where he stands completely rigid and slowly sinks down when his muscles tire. his head is out straight pointed toward the ground, pupils dilated, awake but not able to respond meaningfully. He is 'worried' he wants you to be near him, when he starts to come out of it he will try to follwo you if you elave him even if his legs don't cooperate! Luckily the chances of him hurting himself, other than falling down, are much more slim than the petit and grand mal.

 

I am just debating whether to get a neurologist consult or not....for right now we are just waiting and monitoring. I have only witnessed 6 of these events since august, but the alst one was two kinda together witha short more relaxed phase inbetween, which is worse.

 

ETA- trying to get a photo/video, but so far i have been in another room from the camera and had to stay to stop him falling down!

Edited December 5, 2008 by snakes

[Guest EmilyAnne]

What is he like after these seizures? Does he bounce right back to normal, or seem confused or anxious or over active?

[Guest MZH]

As far as we are aware they are focal seizures. He goes into a state where he stands completely rigid and slowly sinks down when his muscles tire. his head is out straight pointed toward the ground, pupils dilated, awake but not able to respond meaningfully. He is 'worried' he wants you to be near him, when he starts to come out of it he will try to follwo you if you elave him even if his legs don't cooperate! Luckily the chances of him hurting himself, other than falling down, are much more slim than the petit and grand mal.

 

I am just debating whether to get a neurologist consult or not....for right now we are just waiting and monitoring. I have only witnessed 6 of these events since august, but the alst one was two kinda together witha short more relaxed phase inbetween, which is worse.

 

ETA- trying to get a photo/video, but so far i have been in another room from the camera and had to stay to stop him falling down!

 

Here's another thought about it all. We had yet another dog who'd act as you're describing. He eventually developed glomerularnephritis. Apparently his kidneys weren't handling the toxins that were causing his seizure-like, rigid actions. He had a couple of GMs and a stroke in 3 years but had a bunch of the rigid, pupils-dilated ones. His kidney levels didn't seem to be a red flag in the beginning but when we took him to Tufts they said he had high blood pressure and put him on enalapril. We foolishly didn't keep him on it; that was a big mistake but it was never explained to us why he needed to stay on it after his bp normalized. I know now it's like people with high BP; you can't stop bp meds.

 

Another thing he did was "bicycle." One of his rear legs would do a cycling motion, even while walking. He was in a fog when doing this. It's hard to watch and harder to detach from emotions and videotape these events, but it does help the vet make a diagnosis.

 

Marcia

[Guest snakes]

after the events he usually bounces right back. he often just walks a little then curls up on the couch again, but we have taken him out a couple times and he does fine. If we offer a treat he is back to his bouncy self for it.

We have had no spasticity or irrelgualr movements in any body part.

[greypuppyluv]

Has anyone had a CSF tap done? This was one of the tests my vet said could be done to help determine what could be causing Phaelin's seizures.

[Guest MZH]

Has anyone had a CSF tap done? This was one of the tests my vet said could be done to help determine what could be causing Phaelin's seizures.

 

Cullen did. It showed nothing. The MRI showed nothing either. It cost a lot but we knew he didn't have a brain tumor.

 

We lost him to hemangiosarcoma a year and a half later. Were the seizures related to that? Don't know.... he had had Lyme too - twice.

 

Marcia

[Guest snakes]

Has anyone had a CSF tap done? This was one of the tests my vet said could be done to help determine what could be causing Phaelin's seizures.

 

 

we were told that was an option too, along with MRI, EEG (with neurology workup). Personally i don't want to do a csf tap unless necessary and at this point i don't deem it necessesary. Of course, we are much luckier than phaelin, his 'attacks' seem much ore serious. Good luck!, i am sure our posts will cross paths in the future