Sarcoptic Mange - Again

[Guest anneh]

My non grey was dx with sarcoptic mange December/January 06 after a month or two of licking/scratching and then I got bitten and the vet realized that was what he had. They had done a scrape but of course that often does not show SM. We thought it was allergies and seems like it slowly worsened. He was given oral ivermectin weekly for about 4 weeks and it eventually went away. This December 07 he started licking his forelegs and chest but I presumed it was an allergy to an addition to his diet. He does show some allergic response to several food items and basically he is on raw rabbit/veggies altho he tolerates well cooked brown rice also. Sometimes I try adding some fish oil or canned salmon or other meats and he seems to itch so when this happened in December I attributed it to some Honest Kitchen I had started giving him. Anyway, its not improved and now I am worried that he has SM again so have an appt with my vet. I am totally upset because I have now adopted a sheltie and if she needs treatment she couldn't have the ivermectin so I guess would have to use Revolution, I feel so down about this, I take good care of them holistically and do everything I can to give them a good life but somehow I am letting this happen. We live in a rural area on acreage but since the last year they do NOT run outside of our fenced area. No dog in the past has ever had SM on our property. We do walk down a rural road and I have seen a fox but then many other people walk their dog on this road and don't seem to be getting mange. I feel like I am letting my dogs down somehow and now have to poison their system again with horrible medications and what if this keeps happening . I have been praying hard that its not SM but looks like it is. I have been putting an essential oil blend on the areas I see him licking and also I soak the areas with yellow dock tea to help prevent infection from licking. anneh

[Guest guinness_the_greyt]

That sounds terrible! Memphis (greyhound) came to me with terrible itchy skin, loads of hair loss, and some a strange abscess on his hiney that we had to have scrape done on. He has a lot of allergies... some of them are to certain cleaners I have used... also had to change the detergent I used to wash the bedding.

 

You may want to look at any chemicals... detergents etc around the house...

 

Memphis also has a low thyroid... has your dog been checked for the thyroid? The vet said that an untreated low thyroid can make a lowered immune system.... which makes them susceptible to things a normal healthy canine would not get!

 

GOOD LUCK!!

[greyhoundgang]

Don't blame yourself for this. Some dog's systems are just weaker than others.

 

A couple of suggestions:

- the immune system needs to be pumped up. a holistic vet would know the herbs etc that will do this

- stress can cause mange to appear. is there something in the home that would cause stress - kids, a new dog, change in your living situation

- dogs don't need grains. raw feeding is good for immune systems. much info on the internet about that. naturallygrey at yahoogroups is a list of greyhound lovers feeding raw.

- oils - i've seen allergies to flax oil, but not to the other omega 3's, which are usually good to give.

 

Hope you and your boy find relief soon.

 

 

Claudia & Greyhound Gang

Greyhound Gang

 

 

[Guest Brandy_b]

Our pitbullk female has that type of mange too and its a B****!!!!! No other way to put it!!! Its jsut horrible! Her skin smells, flakes off, is all red And the vets are treating her with shots and some creams but it doesnt get better. I feel like nothing is going to work. We even tried feeding her a different diet, etc.

 

You could ask your vet if you could buy some expired revolution, this works well usually for curing mange. Sometimes our vet can get it free for us from the company.

 

<3 Brandy & Caliloka

[Guest laceyj]

My Lacey had SC mange as a very young dog. It was so long ago now, but I don't remember an oral medication, nor revolution. Entirely possible the treatment protocol has changed by now. All I remember was a small tin of a rust colored cream. I put the cream on each bare spot each night. I do remember it took a long time to clear up. But it finally did and she never had a recurrence.

 

As a side not, not sure if it's related in her case, she had flea allergies. For her the battle against fleas was worse. Although she was treated for fleas monthly, one flea bite sent her into weeks of itching. She spent years on and off preds. It wasn't until I moved that we finally truly got away from the fleas.

 

Sorry, guess I'm not any help. But I do feel your pain.

[Burpdog]

I had a Dane get Saracoptic mange (which is the contagious one) and she never left the yard. The vet told me a bird could have dropped it off for us.

 

Something where you are has it. Trying to figure out where/who can be difficult.

[Neighsayer]

My collie/chow mix and 2 goldens all had it a few years ago.The scrapings were positive on the goldens so we didn't bother testing the chow. I could only handle 2 at a time in the car so they did not all go to that first appointment. The goldens did fine on ivermectin and the chow responded well to revolution. It just takes soooo long and naked long haired dogs are not pretty. I still have no idea how they got it.

Good luck!

[Hubcitypam]

I've had a couple of fosters with SM and Revolution worked extremely well.

[Guest anneh]

thank you all for responding, I appreciate it. I feel better about it and not so depressed anneh

[Guest gomiesmom]

I cannot comment on the mange, and I assume that its a medical condition but just by the description, there is some supplement advertised on the radio here called Dinovite. The radio testimonials talk about "stinky" dogs, hots pots, hair loss, etc. They don't claim to "cure" a medical condition, but say that vets who have been prescribing creams, etc for their itchy, stinky dogs cannot believe the difference. I think the website is www.dinovite.com. Don't know if the advertisement is regional or if it even works, but it may be worth a visit to the website for a skin-type condition.

[silverfish]

If your vet didn't get a definitive diagnosis, I'd go for another skin scrape, maybe do a biopsy. It's possible that he has demodectic mange not sarcoptic, although demodex tends not to itch so much - if he has mange at all. I'm not sure what the bite has to do with it?

 

Demodex is not infectious. They acquire it as pups - in fact 99% of all dogs have it and it doesn't cause any problems, but in dogs with weakened immune systems, you can get mange symptoms. It's a darned nuisance, because it flares up each time they're stressed, or low in health, and can come back spontaneously when they get older.

 

Our first dog was demodectic. It's important to know which type of mange they have, because although the treatment for the symptoms is the same, demodectic dogs should never have steroids, or other drugs which suppress the immune system.

 

I understand your fear for your sheltie - Jim was not tattooed, he was Traveller-bred, and my vet wouldn't give him Ivermectin because of the possibility he had collie in his ancestry (though he looked pure grey). We treated him topically, with an organo-phosphate bath. Nasty, nasty stuff, and in fact not recommended for greyhounds, but it was fine. We took great care with it, and he didn't suffer any ill-effects at all. That was when he was two years old and he lived to thirteen and a half - no kidney or liver issues at all. He did develop minor tremors as he got old, but nothing to bother him too much and it's impossible to pin that on something that was done 10-11 years earlier.

 

Personally, I'd do further investigation to find out exactly what it is your dog has. It may not be mange at all. Can you get a referral to a skin specialist?

 

 

 

[Guest longdogs]

There's no problem using Revolution, if that's actually what the problem is. From your description I'm guessing it's something else. Revolution is really not very toxic, possibly less so than the essential oils you are using, and you might consider using it as an alternative to their regular heartworm treatment.

 

stress can cause mange to appear

 

Stress can certainly make animals much more susceptible to a mange attack but cannot cause it. It is a mite infection and mites need to be transferred from one creature to another. Humans can get it too and it is not pleasant.

[silverfish]

Stress can certainly make animals much more susceptible to a mange attack but cannot cause it. It is a mite infection and mites need to be transferred from one creature to another. Humans can get it too and it is not pleasant.

 

Stress cannot cause sarcoptic mange, but it CAN cause an outbreak of demodex. Demodectic mange is caused by an obligate canine parasite which only cause problems in immune-deficient animals.

 

They're both caused by a mite but sarcoptic mange is very contagious and can be transferred from animal to animal easily, while demodex cannot. Firstly the demodex mite lives deep inside the hair follicles, and secondly, a dog with a healthy immune system probably already has them, but they won't get diseased because their immune system naturally keeps the mites well under control.

 

That's one reason it's very important to get a diagnosis.

[Burpdog]

I reread the original post after reading silverfish's answer. Yes, you have to know exactly what you are dealing with!

 

I had a Dobe with DM years ago and she had a thyroid deficiency. Once on thyroid, along with other treatment, it did not reappear.

 

I personally with not use Revolution as it has the highest adverse reaction rate of all the hw preventatives.

 

If your vet does not know exactly what this is, I'd see a specialist.

[Guest longdogs]

Stress cannot cause sarcoptic mange, but it CAN cause an outbreak of demodex. Demodectic mange is caused by an obligate canine parasite which only cause problems in immune-deficient animals.

Very true but no mite, no mange. About 20% of strays carry them, I'm not sure about well-cared-for dogs.

[Guest wolfieskitten]

IF you can get Advocate from Australia, that will fix it! IT's just not sold in the USA yet for some reason. It is a Bayer product and many people are now buying on the net from OZ.

 

You do not have to have a prescription to buy it here as it is sold without them. It is also much cheaper, even with shipping costs. We have found that for a dog over 25kgs (54 pounds and up) it's sold at around $10 per vial each month.

 

On the front of the package it states:

 

100g/L Imidacloprid

25 g/L Moxidectin

 

Kills:

 

Fleas, fleas larvae, prevents heart worms, controls intestinal worms, intestinal worm larvae, sarcoptic mange, demodectic mange, ear mites, and lice.

 

It's a monthly topical treatment just like Revolution but it does not do anything for ticks, still have to use a tick collar with it but that's a minor thing for me. It's highly recommended for use in greyhounds as well. We have had no problems with its use in the GAP program here. We are also sponsored by Bayer which means it is provided to us for no cost for our foster program , which is also quite sweet!

Edited January 17, 2008 by wolfieskitten

[silverfish]

Stress cannot cause sarcoptic mange, but it CAN cause an outbreak of demodex. Demodectic mange is caused by an obligate canine parasite which only cause problems in immune-deficient animals.

Very true but no mite, no mange. About 20% of strays carry them, I'm not sure about well-cared-for dogs.

 

I think you have misunderstood demodex. Pretty much all dogs have them - that's what's meant by 'obligate parasite' and people have them too. It's only when the immune system is compromised that they get the upper hand and cause disease.

 

It is well established that the demodex mites are carried on almost all healthy dogs and spend their entire life in the hair follicles without causing problems for most dogs.

 

Source

 

 

 

And this from the Merck Vet Manual online -

 

Canine Demodicosis:

This skin disease of dogs occurs when large numbers of Demodex canis mites inhabit hair follicles and sebaceous glands. In small numbers, these mites are part of the normal flora of the skin of dogs and cause no clinical disease. The mites are transmitted from dam to puppies during nursing within the first 72 hr after birth.

 

I don't know what the percentage of wild animals carrying sarcoptic mange is, but it could well be around twenty percent. Anyway, that's why it's important to know which you're dealing with.