3greytjoys
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I'm not clear if he's refusing his last outing on the days your husband has been taking him outside so much, or if it's on days he's only had 3 other outings, or on all days? What duration are his outings?
Considering the cold winter season, please consider any potential medical discomfort first. Dogs' unprotected paws can quickly become painfully sore or damaged by cold, dry asphalt/cement; snow; ice, etc. Dogs can suffer from Chilblains disease (vessel circulation problems in cold weather); frostbite; burn from road salts, etc. If paw pads get wet, ice or snow can build up on fur around paw pads, and become impacted between pads. If not cleaned out after each outing, that ice can continue damaging cell tissue for a long period even after dog is back home resting. (I've experienced Chilblains and Raynaud's phenomenon which are extremely painful conditions. If not caught in time and progresses untreated, damaged/dying tissue can lead to gangrene, requiring amputation.)
Whether medical, physical (e.g., too tired/exhausted) or behavioral, please consider that growling is his only polite/respectful way of communicating his serious discomfort about the situation he's facing. He's just trying to protect himself (from humans invading his space with intent to force him out). Safer to respect his warning. Please do not scold him for growling. If scolded, it could push him into escalating to a snap/bite to communicate his seriousness.
- First, I'd ask DH to reduce or eliminate several of your Greyhound's non-essential daytime walks.
- Increase the value of hound's late night treats (e.g., smelly liver, tripe, other meats) offered only to lure him up for last potty outings of the night.
- Try reducing his dinner by 1/2 cup kibble. Then offer 1/2 cup food just before his last potty outing (to help encourage him to leave his bed).
- Depending on hound's meal times, perhaps try skipping the potty outing just prior to his last bedtime outing.
Any obedience training should be positive, reward-based methods. (I like to capture Greyhounds doing a desired behavior naturally, teach verbal cue and reward the action immediately.) Please let us know how it goes.
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Once the urine scent is removed and fabric is dry, wrapping up and tying your floor length draperies safely far above his body's reach could temporarily help remove that attraction. Draperies probably look more like an appropriate pee spot to male dogs (vertical tree/shrub shape).
Greyhounds are an independent thinking breed, and are encouraged to tune-out bystanders' yelling during races. The racing Greyhound is expected to focus only on chasing their prey/lure (not to respond to humans). Your boy may not have experienced anyone yelling at him for doing anything wrong; thus, appearing to have "selective hearing". He was probably just puzzled (and busy urinating) more than anything when a human suddenly started yelling.
Eventually if desired, you could gradually try to teach him to ring a bell when he needs to go potty. This clear dog-to-human communication has been extremely helpful for all of my dogs (and me) for many decades.
Bell touch training steps below:
Teaching sessions should stay under 5 minutes to keep hound's attention. (Greyhounds shut down to learning if sessions take too long.)
Hopefully, the bell doesn't have any sharp edges, if so, cover with stick-on felt.
1. Place a bell on floor by door, hide meat treats under bell (and around bell if needed).
2. Encourage him to sniff for treats. Whenever his nose happens to "touch" the bell, happily praise "good touch!" and reward with the treats (by lifting up the bell for him to eat his treats).
Repeat this fun game for only a few minutes.
Then stop for the day.
3. Next day: Practice above steps for a minute or two as a refresher.
4. Only if he's caught on well... next, lift bell in air (on your flat hand) a little closer to door knob.
Encourage him to "touch bell". Whenever his nose touches bell, reward with treats from under bell.
Repeat only a few times then stop for day.
5. Next day: Practice yesterday's lesson briefly.
6. After he really understands the "touch" cue, hang the bell on the door knob (up high, close to the knob).
Again, hold treats under the bell on your flat hand. Repeat "touch bell" practice steps.
Then stop for the day.
After he understands the "touch bell" game really well, begin asking him to "touch bell" immediately before you open the door to take him outside for all eliminations.
Keep treats handy to help reinforce this action until he begins associating the natural secondary reward of being able to eliminate immediately after ringing his bell.
Once he begins ringing the bell on his own as a communication signal to his humans that he needs to eliminate, his humans' ongoing job is to drop everything and immediately take him outside for eliminations.
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Honestly? Just take him out more often and watch him (or leash him to yourself) when indoors.
We don't worry about the VOG, just a sharp enough sound to interrupt the activity when we've missed the earlier signs (UH UH or AAAAAAAAAH! works fine, followed by a cheerful -- not angry! -- "Let's go out!"). Earlier signs = dog is on his/her feet and isn't actively playing or eating = dog should be taken outside. We tend to take a new dog outdoors @ every 1.5 hours and gradually increase the time between outs as the dog learns. Taking them out often also helps form the habit of going out (rather than staying in
) when nature calls.We have had very few accidents during housetraining, over the years.
This ^
It really doesn't matter whether he's marking or fully urinating, he simply doesn't understand home life yet. He's never learned how or needed to provide cues for humans to let him outside because he was likely on a strict kennel schedule, including meals and turn-outs. Treat him as if you were house training a young puppy (but racers are easier since they can usually hold it most of the night while sleeping, daytime napping is different).
If a dog is having an elimination accident, I happily call the dog or approach the dog silently to gently escort him/her outside, then happily praise for eliminating outside. One exception: some dogs physically/medically can't stop their eliminations mid-stream, in which case, it's easier to let them finish eliminating in one spot vs. rushing them through the house to get outside. Thereafter, watch the dog more carefully and escort outside the instant they awaken from a nap, after playing, before and after meals, just before bedtime, etc. I agree with leashing a dog to a human when not in crate during early house training. (Please do not tether a Greyhound to any object -- many safety reasons for this.) If using a belly band under supervision, please remove it before dog goes outside, and it should be changed immediately if wet (to prevent urine scald, rashes, infections, etc.).
A raised voice often backfires by frightening some dogs into running away from a human while dog is continuing to release urine or is defecating.
A spray bottle is not desirable because it teaches dogs to fear their human, fear bottles, fear their home environment, and cower away from other people.
Better to work on building the most positive, trusting relationship possible with newly adopted Greyhounds. Greyhounds are a wonderfully sensitive breed.
Congratulations on your new boy! Thank you for your interest in helping guide him through this early adjustment stage. Greyhounds reward us tenfold ++.
BTW, Nature's Miracle "Advanced Formula" works well for us, but test on fabric or carpet for color fastness before using on a conspicuous area.
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Welcome to GreyTalk Jamie, Nik and Basil!Congratulations on your adoption of Basil! Seems you've struck gold with Basil's fabulous character and stunningly handsome appearance.
We wish you all many happy years together.
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Since Merlin was just adopted into his new forever home (with children and cats) 1 month ago; his outings may be increased (at least partly) due to settling into a completely different life. Medical clearance is important first, and helps to establish a baseline with your vet.
Another perspective: My fosters from the track are taken out every hour (or so) during daytime/evening the first day in a home; then every 2 hours for a few days; then every 3 hours, etc. (Our group requires a minimum of outings every 4 hours during day/evening throughout their life.) All of our own resident hounds have naturally asked for a minimum of 5 to 7 potty outings per day. Currently, our 15 year old needs even more outside potty opportunities.
Dogs can easily learn a new place to go potty. Assuming your garden is fully fenced; consider escorting him in your garden using two leashes tightly knotted together (to temporarily allow extra length for his potty privacy). Reward every potty action in his own garden with treats and happy praise. During these potty training sessions, do not even take him to the field as an option. He'll catch on with positive consistency.
Please use a standard 6' leash (or shorter) for regular walks. Double-long leash length is too hazardous for normal use for sighthounds.
(Greyhound adoption groups in USA require retired racing Greyhounds only be allowed off leash within fully-fenced spaces; thus, the assumption that your garden is fenced.)
Normal water consumption for dogs can change due to activity, weather, indoor temperature, lower humidity, medical conditions, etc.
Below are veterinarians' examples for dogs' normal water intake by body weight:
60 lbs. = 6 cups to 7.5 cups per day
70 pounds = 7 to 8.75 cups per day
80 pounds = 8 to 10 cups per day
90 pounds = 9 to 11.25 cups per day
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I'm curious about the duration of your hounds' stay at your DD's house, and how long the hounds have been back home with you?
After ruling out medical, I'd lean towards learned and/or coping behavior and higher stress levels. Similar to changing homes types of stress; Annie trying to find her place in DD's existing family, etc. The resident dogs may have been causing Annie more stress than your DD saw. Also, as dogs age, they often can't tolerate changes as well as when younger. If any stress signals are noticed from Annie before going after Felix, I'd try to intercept with happy, positive distractions/separations before she reaches her tolerance threshold. Sometimes stressful reprimands after the fact increase dogs' overall stress levels causing them to react more negatively and faster in silence. The combined stresses could also affect Felix more deeply.
I cared for a solo hound visitor who did fine for short-term durations (e.g., long weekends), but her internal stress level heightened dramatically if her parents were gone much longer. Our pack is wonderfully calm and accepting of all other Greyhound visitors and fosters, but that visitor lived as a single pet at her home. After her own time threshold, the visitor would exhibit similar behavior of semi-aggressively charging my hounds from afar.
Post Annie's vacation stay, she may be moving her kibble to help create her own needed private eating space. Perhaps moving her meal station to a more private area could help her feel safer.
Good luck and please let us know how it goes.
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Robin:
Not sure if your friend's hound eats raw meat, but Alabama Rot is suspected to be linked to raw meats (similar to E.Coli), so it could be present in Canada. The disease is found in the USA; SE Asia; Mexico; it's currently seen in the UK; and other regions. Commonly seen in fall/autumn season.
In a nutshell, it is not always fatal, but can be fatal (in as little as 24 hours) if renal failure and/or thrombocytopenia is evident. Treatments differ depending on which of four patterns of clinical signs the hound is presenting. If the disease is caught immediately, before rapid progression, up to 50% of hounds could potentially respond favorably to rapid treatment.
I have Care of The Racing and Retired Greyhound. If needed, if you want to PM me, perhaps I could read that section to you.
Dick is correct. B. Fenwick is the name quoted in this book.
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Welcome back to GT! Welcome handsome Roper! Wishing you a long, happy life together...
Hoping for more photos as he settles into his new home.
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Small balls of canned ground meat dog food (some with hidden pills) can be a helpful also.
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Oh goodness, he's adorable! Love those darling earsies!
Thank you for caring for him.
(Secretly hoping he might snuggle his way into your hearts forever.
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I agree with Neylasmom. If you're unable to get a more detailed diagnosis, perhaps a different test and/or second opinion could help(?).
Our Greyhounds are very stoic, but they are smart in knowing when their body is not up to certain movement/activities. I try to watch and respect our hounds' physical limitations, especially when they're struggling with injury or illness. I probably wouldn't try to push the main staircase activity too much. Perhaps arranging sleeping quarters downstairs could help for a while(?).
He might be feeling weaker due to reduced food intake, medications, and/or his illness. When our hounds are taking medications, I look up the veterinary side effects of each medication. Many medications affect appetite level, some increase drowsiness, cause ataxia (wobbly coordination), etc. If meds are supposed to be given with food, he might eat various flavors of canned ground meat dog foods more easily. If meds are given on an empty stomach, it can make them feel poorly overall, and reduce their interest in eating meals.
BTW, a nice visual indication of healthy pet Greyhound weight is seeing the last two ribs (and hip points). Thank you for letting us know about Kentucky's update. Continued positive healing thoughts for Kentucky.
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Congratulations on your adoption of Hanna! She's a gorgeous black beauty!
May you have many happy, healthy years enjoying life together...
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Are you able to please post a photo of your girl's paws?
(I'll be off-line for a day or so, but a photo could help others respond too.)
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I'm truly sorry about your sudden loss of Leia. What a terribly sad, tragic accident. I wish I could help take away your pain. I hope your wife will be able to release feelings of guilt, for her own health and well-being. This seems like a freak accident, no one's fault. (I knew another hound who passed away after sliding hard into a wall. I've heard of other dogs who exhibited a bolt of speed just prior to their passing.)
Leia's crossing touches me in a unique way, perhaps because I've dreaded seeing her name in Remembrance. Your deep love for Leia has been reflected in your posts for many years. She always seemed to be your beloved special companion/family member. I hope, in time, that you will both be able to find some comfort in your happy memories of her. Leia will be remembered fondly on GT.
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One cup of kibble is not enough food for a Greyhound considering any kibble I've ever seen. Caloric content varies greatly. Some kibble is in the 300(+) range vs. one example is Innova's 519 calories per cup (per Innova's current website). When we fed Innova (long ago) all our Greyhounds maintained healthy pet weight on approx. 3(+) cups kibble per day.
Kibble manufacturers list feeding guidelines on bag for their specific food's caloric content, per AAFCO guidelines.
Quoted below is from “Feeding” by Joan Martin (see pet Greyhound caloric needs chart in red bold):
“A highly conditioned dog will have more muscle mass, which is both denser and heavier, than the same size dog that is out of condition. Age, exercise, stress caused by both heat and cold, and general health all influence the best weight for an individual dog.
The following chart shows the calories needed to maintain weight for dogs kept as pets getting moderate exercise:
weight (lbs) / calories
50 1,350
57 1,482
66 1,650
88 2,112
End quote.
Source: http://www.adopt-a-greyhound.org/advice/general_advice/feeding.shtml
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Ditto Batmom's suggestion.
Also, even if King has a tiring power walk (including ample non-rushed potty stops) within an hour or so of your departure, ensure he has one more brief potty opportunity within the last 5-10 minutes before humans leave the house, Plus, please arrange for King to have a mid-day potty break, whether one of you go home at lunch, or hire a dog sitter/walker, or teach Greyhound safety to rely on a dog experienced adult neighbor. A full work day is too long for many dogs to be forced to hold urine and bowel, especially newly adopted dogs. (Our group requires potty outings every 4 hours during the day, especially important for young, newly retired, crated dogs.) Four months is still very early in the adjustment period. We see settling changes in Greyhounds well into the first couple of years, and beyond. If King has had repeating episodes of panic while trying to avoid messing in his crate for many hours, it could be a cause desperate barking, shredding bedding, etc. It may help to understand the timing of his restless activities.
Remember to tall dog-proof any room/s to which he will have access. Okay to baby-gate him into the most family used room/s during the day (i.e., where he feels most comfortable while humans are home). Good luck, and please let us know how it goes in case additional options are needed.
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Welcome to GreyTalk!
First, I'm so relieved that Kentucky survived that 107 F. temperature! Wow, that was close. I can imagine how relieved you must feel that his condition is not from osteo. Poor boy, no wonder he's been feeling so ill. Glad you have his diagnosis now so he can be treated. Curious if your vet mentioned which type of tick borne illness(?). Great that you're already seeing a bit of improvement.
My only TBD experience was 35 years ago with a different breed. My dog suddenly became completely paralyzed from a tick bite. I was afraid it was permanent, but the vet pulled him out of it with careful treatment. Thankfully, he fully recovered and lived a long, healthy life thereafter. The region had a lot of ticks, but we avoided future problems by avoiding tall grasses and shrubs. After leashed walks, he was inspected for ticks. A flea comb can be very useful to help find ticks also.
I'm not clear if Kentucky's 70 degrees F. walk was in sun, or the duration of his walk, but many healthy Greyhounds can't handle very much walking over about 70 to 72 F, especially if in direct sun. Our hounds slowly begin melting at 70 F -- in the shade.
Please let us know how things go with Kentucky. He will be in our healing thoughts.
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Assuming Wally didn't further damage his spine or legs during his falls, in time, he may fully recover to his previous mobility. Our elder hound had a couple of slides this year (when I was nearby to help). She eventually recovered and retained her normal mobility thereafter. She's still independent, mobile, and playfully trot-runs briefly in the garden. The medical assistance harness (post #18) has been a huge help during recovery periods, and I carry it separately during outings and vet visits as a priceless(!) safety net.
Seeh2o: IMO, Gabapentin could be helpful enough for your friend to discuss with a vet. Works for LP and LS hounds, as both involve the nervous system. A couple of our hounds have been on it successfully fairly long-term. It likely will not prevent the hound's hind-end from sinking but should reduce pain levels. Our vet starts dogs on a low end dosage for body-drug adjustment, and leaves room for dosage to be increased if/when pain worsens.
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Similar situation here with a mid-teen hound (but she's not left alone). Agree with a human at home whenever possible, and nanny cam otherwise. I'd suggest isolating Wally in his most used, comfortable room with a baby-gate. If it doesn't already have wall-to wall carpet, borrow or buy the largest textured area rug you can find to fit that whole room. Carpet stores might have used scrap carpet from a recent install.
Our LS hound needs to stand, walk around, and re-position periodically. (Can help relieve nerve pressure.) Thinking a crate might be a little too confining(?) for Wally, and more painful forcing him to stay in one position too long. I would not recommend an ex-pen in this case just because he could accidentally push it over, or collapse it onto himself while trying to stand up. I'm unclear how far off the ground his bed sits, but it helps to arrange floor beds in a semi-confined corner space, so when attempting to stand up, he can press his legs against a wall, or heavy sofa, if sofa is built solidly to floor level. (A wadded blanket blocks off the crevice under our sofa to prevent hound's paws from sliding under sofa.)
Walk-a-bout medical assistance harnesses can be helpful for hounds with LS:"Airlift One" back-end harness works for males. (We have the "original" back-end harness for females.): http://www.walkaboutharnesses.com/collections/walkabout-harnesses
(They have amputee slings too.)
I'm so sorry Wally is having LS difficulty. He's probably much more sore now from his two previous falls. Hope the Gabapentin helps.
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Yes, I give capsules daily. One of our hounds was prescribed 23 pills per day for a while. The pill popper device is made with two small slits at rubber end to accommodate flatter tablets or capsules. It's not meant to cover the capsule 100%, just enough to hold capsule in place.
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Another option is using a pill popper: http://www.entirelypets.com/pillgun.html
I couldn't live without pill poppers. I keep them upstairs and downstairs to use for cats and hounds. Best thing a vet recommended to me 3 decades ago.
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Welcome to GreyTalk!
How long has this hound been in your family? I'm a little confused about why he can't be in another room.
Dogs repeat behaviors that work for them. Since your hound's behavior has been reinforced repeatedly by scoring human foods from your children, he needs to be redirected to an alternative acceptable behavior.
Happily teach him to go to his "place" or whatever you want to call a thick, comfy dog bed in the next room(?) or near the same room entryway but not in traffic path. (He needs to see and feel as part of the family). Similar to the "crate" golden rule, also keep "place" as a happy, safe, undisturbed rest zone for him i.e., never send him there as punishment, and don't let children disturb him when he's lying down. Humans should wait until he's standing far away from his bed for affection. A baby-gate at your dining(?) room entryway could help block him out of that room until training is solidified. I assume he already knows "down" (to lie down). If not, capture his natural down, give it a verbal name "down", and be ready with treats to reward him immediately.
Teach "place" or "bed" by tossing treats on that bed. Each time he touches the bed, happily reward with a treat mini-party. Then begin fine-tuning by rewarding only when he's lying down touching the bed. Then reward only when he's fully centered on the bed (vs. 1/2 body on bed and 1/2 body off bed). Thereafter, immediately before humans' actual meals, offer potty outing, then happily cue your hound to go to his place AND give him a safe, busy treat like a frozen food Kong to lick while children are eating in dining room. Make it a special, happy time for him too!
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Glad she's better. What is beautiful Lola's age?
Not sure about her ease of transfer in/out of car. We have this ramp that has horizontal ridges that greatly help our geriatric hounds grip the ramp's surface.
PetSTEP ramp: https://www.amazon.com/PetSTEP-Folding-Pet-Ramp-Khaki/dp/B00006OALW(Initial practice sessions with ramp on flat surface first.)
Our eldest teens were veterinarian authorized to stop vaccinations (due to terminal medical conditions + protected environment). Yes. physical exams become more important as they age into their teens -- annually at minimum, every 6 months is highly encouraged. Agree that mobile vets are great for this care. In a pinch, our regular vet has done exams on our hounds in back of the car, or hospital parking lot, but it's more challenging for vet to reach/exam hound in car, and less time efficient (retrieving items). Exam room allows for more thorough care.
Not sure of your car type or it's set-up for hounds. We've filled open floor gaps between seats and hounds' cargo space with even level strong plastic storage box containers, or strong cardboard boxes filled with books. Comforters shoved in to fill gaps help prevent a leg getting caught. There are pet-friendly contraptions on market that hang across that space for sedans, but might be difficult for dogs in a moving vehicle(?). The back 2/3 of our SUV is flat with tightly fitted wall-to-wall dense foam mats, so hounds can grip and balance well if standing.
I keep a list of all our area mobile vets + their work days/hours on the refrigerator. A priceless time saver!
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Thought some folks might find the following 3 diagrams interesting:
This basic nerve diagram illustrates nerves in the neck and throughout the body.
(Head shown on second diagram; arteries on third diagram.)
To enlarge: press ctrl and + key
To reduce: ctrl and - key
Nervous System of Dog
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Superficial Nerves of Head
As we can imagine, squeezing (or jerking) any length of metal chain on a dog’s neck risks internal damage.
More risky for our thin skinned Greyhound breed who lacks fat, thick fur or undercoat.
My understanding is the vagus nerve is the longest nerve in the body, and connects the brain with all internal organs.
Neck/throat nerve damage can eventually extend through the body through the vagus nerve, spinal cord, etc.
One of our hounds died from complications stemmed from prior collar injuries that caused laryngeal paralysis, which later extended into nerve body paralysis. Sadly, another one of our hounds who arrived into retirement with LP will likely follow a similar path. Having lived with the daily struggles of our hounds’ diagnosis, in addition to five decades of personal multi-faceted canine experience, I agree with veterinarians, and other professionals who consider metal chain collars dangerous. I agree that full choke chains are much worse, but limited choke chains are risky too. (BTW, unfortunately, laryngeal paralysis and other chain-related neck injuries are very common in AKC show dogs.) Thankfully, fully webbed nylon martingales were invented as an improved soft collar option for gentle use on sighthounds.
Welcome to GreyTalk Jamie, Nik and Basil!
Whining....new Behavior
in Training and Behavior discussion
Posted
If Ruby has something important to communicate like needing a potty outing, that's important to provide. If she might need to eliminate, escort her outside and watch her eliminate, then take her back inside immediately. Otherwise, ignore her whining. (If needed, consider wearing ear plugs.)
Do not engage in that type of two-way verbal communication if you don't want to encourage it.
Teach her "quiet" or whatever cue you prefer. Remember to reward her with praise after she's been quiet for a few minutes.
Please don't put her outside as a punishment. She won't understand; plus, Greyhounds are indoor dogs and shouldn't be left outside for extended periods of time, especially in winter or summer temperatures.
Also, her whining is likely to escalate by being left alone outside.